The Netherlands NETHERLANDS 2024 - Joost Klein - Europapa

[ESC United Mod Team]

 

[Chorizo]

AVROTROS has released a statement about the joost situation

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1789319540905587063

It is absolute ridiculous that he was disqualified for such a minor incidence. Shame on you, EBU! I'm wondering if his support for Palestine influenced their decision.

 

[Rocket man]

This sounds like a clash of cultures has just happened here. Which is probably why the Dutch delegation are so bemused by this.

 

[Jupiter]

From reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/eurovision/comments/1cpefb1/comment/l3k5j92/
"I'm Dutchie living in Sweden, and was once almost fired from a university teaching job because of a single student complaint after bluntly telling my students that many of their assignments don't bother to include their name and student nr, or use basic punctuation, and that I'm not ever going to grade them until they fix that (note: so not even saying I would fail them. I gave them infinite retries).

So I'm obviously biased by the experience but I am more inclined to believe it's a clash of cultures: Dutch bluntness vs Swedish direct conflict avoidance and aggressive conflict escalation via official complaint channels.

---

edit: since this is getting more visibility than I expected, I want to add a bit of nuance so people don't think I'm crapping on Swedish culture. I think both countries are charming because of these cultural traits, the problem is that both can take it too far, and since they are polar opposites it can really clash. But I like living here partially because the Dutch bluntness often manifests as aggressively asserting opinions as truths with unearned confidence, whereas in my experience Swedes tend to be a lot more aware that whatever they say is their interpretation, and much more willing to listen to each other's pov. In a perfect world our countries would learn a bit from each other here."

If so, I hope Martin Österdahl is even more embarassed about his dumb "thankfully the contest is back in Sweden after the turbulent last renditions" comment......

 

[BorisBubbles]

So this is about the recorded incident where Israelis record him without consent, the same video that was leaked on X? And is indeed one of the people filming part of the songwriting team of Israel?

This incident is separate from that one. The Israeli delegation is not directly responsible for Joost's DQ, as per the EBU's statement and I'm inclined to believe that. He offended a very, very sensitive individual with idk, a gesture, and she filed an official complaint with the police.

 

[Rasmus0714]

This incident is separate from that one. The Israeli delegation is not directly responsible for Joost's DQ, as per the EBU's statement and I'm inclined to believe that. He offended a very, very sensitive individual with idk, a gesture, and she filed an official complaint with the police.

Also from reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/eurovision/comments/1cpefb1/comment/l3k8oeb/
"Your assessment based off your anecdotal experience unfortunately is reality of the general climate in Sweden. For instance, if people have problems with a neighbor they will do anything but speak directly to that neighbor"
"Oh I know, I once tried apologizing to an elderly neighbor for making too much noise at 4:00 AM after she complained to the landlord about it. And I was going there because she was completely right and wanted to let her know how sorry I was. Despite that she still was so scared of me being angry about her complaint that she tried avoiding me after the apology"

 

[Magimixer]

I am just wondering if this is the end of Eurovision. With all the countries saying they will withdraw, I wonder how many will come back next year. I also feel bad for Luxembourg they picked the wrong year to come back.

To be honest – though I've been waiting decades for us to come back –I would gladly have waited another year instead of having Luxembourg come back this year

 

[Magimixer]

This incident is separate from that one. The Israeli delegation is not directly responsible for Joost's DQ, as per the EBU's statement and I'm inclined to believe that. He offended a very, very sensitive individual with idk, a gesture, and she filed an official complaint with the police.

Nothing to do with the Israeli delegation. There were witnesses when it happened, and it was filmed. It was not 'just' a verbal threat… I hope EBU releases the footage when they can.

 

[Rubine]

There were witnesses when it happened, and it was filmed. It was not 'just' a verbal threat… I hope EBU releases the footage when they can.

In a Dutch news broadcast a Swedish police spokesman said it was NOT physical!

 

[kipthechipdip]

To be honest – though I've been waiting decades for us to come back –I would gladly have waited another year instead of having Luxembourg come back this year

This is a show that I won't be as sad when it's over.

 

[Franco]

There is one thing I don't understand: the person doing the filming was still and they were filming Joost while he was passing by, or were they following Joost while filming him?

 

[Fluke]

I see Joost becoming the runaway success of this year. The song already vent viral outside of Europe after the semi performance. It plays into US and other non-Europeans stereotypes of Europe, intentionally or not. Clearly he's gonna be the one artist this year to gain most from the contest, and do international tours.

 

[Reinventor]

Nothing to do with the Israeli delegation. There were witnesses when it happened, and it was filmed. It was not 'just' a verbal threat… I hope EBU releases the footage when they can.

Police confirmed it was a verbal threat, not a physical one. If AVRO/TROS is telling the truth, and I have no reason to doubt them, watch EBU accidentally lose that footage. This is not related to the Israeli situation at all.

Police is investigating because they received a complaint, apparently from a very sensitive person. This is a culture clash, and EBU should have been above that.

 

[Ted Talks]

Police confirmed it was a verbal threat, not a physical one. If AVRO/TROS is telling the truth, and I have no reason to doubt them, watch EBU accidentally lose that footage. This is not related to the Israeli situation at all.

Police is investigating because they received a complaint, apparently from a very sensitive person. This is a culture clash, and EBU should have been above that.

is pretty much all I can say to the bit in bold. The idiocy is astounding really.

I get you're not happy that Joost has been disqualified, but there are legal processes that are having to be followed.

To just spout stupid claims like you are and claim the alleged victim is just a "very sensitive person" really shows you up as pretty horrid.

 

[Rasmus0714]

is pretty much all I can say to the bit in bold. The idiocy is astounding really.

I get you're not happy that Joost has been disqualified, but there are legal processes that are having to be followed.

To just spout stupid claims like you are and claim the alleged victim is just a "very sensitive person" really shows you up as pretty horrid.

Isn't Swedish police said it's not physical?

 

[Ted Talks]

Isn't Swedish police said it's not physical?

A threat or something that intimidates doesn't have to be physical, does it?

If the alleged victim felt threatened or anything like that by what Joost is supposed to have done, then that is that.

I think the way Reinventor has been posting is that anything Joost would have done would be justified because it was Joost.

 

[LivingOrganism]

Isn't Swedish police said it's not physical?

"Joost Klein has been interrogated by the Swedish police. The police shares that Joost Klein is suspected of 'unlawful threats' that took place at the Malmö Arena Thursday night. No announcements have been made about the nature of the threats. That incident is said to have taken place Thursday night. The complaint was filed Friday." - from NOS

For context, the fact that he's accused of "unlawful threats" doesn't mean that there was no physical confrontation involved.

 

[Reinventor]

is pretty much all I can say to the bit in bold. The idiocy is astounding really.

I get you're not happy that Joost has been disqualified, but there are legal processes that are having to be followed.

To just spout stupid claims like you are and claim the alleged victim is just a "very sensitive person" really shows you up as pretty horrid.

Funny you say that as I don’t exactly think very highly of you either after reading your comments today. And that’s understatement.

 

[Rubine]

"Joost Klein has been interrogated by the Swedish police. The police shares that Joost Klein is suspected of 'unlawful threats' that took place at the Malmö Arena Thursday night. No announcements have been made about the nature of the threats. That incident is said to have taken place Thursday night. The complaint was filed Friday." - from NOS

For context, the fact that he's accused of "unlawful threats" doesn't mean that there was no physical confrontation involved.

To the Dutch news a Swedish spokeswoman from the police said it was not physically.

And why if there is proof on tape and all these witnesses, as suggested here, why isn’t he detained?

 

[Ted Talks]

Funny you say that as I don’t exactly think very highly of you either after reading your comments today. And that’s understatement.

What a pity after my posts about following the law and not spouting conspiracy theories. How awful of me indeed...

 

[Reinventor]

What a pity after my posts about following the law and not spouting conspiracy theories. How awful of me indeed...

You’d be willing to hang Joost based on your comments. You immediately jumped to conclusions and didn’t pay any attention to actual facts, even when they were presented to you. You even call people horrid when they present you with data that doesn’t fit your narrative. Yeah, not a fan of you.