Jury - fair or not fair? That's the question.

[FoxOfShadows]

Juries from western Europe should be banned and warned for screwing up chances of for instance Poland in 100% political moves. Don't for a second think that western juries aren't biased, it's apparent when they purposely put a country pretty much dead last because they know that they might be popular with televoters but aren't the "right country".

I'd love to hear your opinion on Igranka

 

[A-lister]

If you think for a second that Ireland and UK have the biggest Polish diaspora, then the televoting results were biased anyway

But juries are not here to punish countries because they happen to have diaspora... that's EQUALLY bad... and actually even more bad because they are supposed to be "professionals" and not vote for countries , but for songs.

Anyways, as I've stated yearly now (and we see the results aswell), it's a MAJOR issue for a contest like EUROvision which is supposed to be a contest of EUROPEAN music that we have juries that punish EVERYTHING that is locally sounding... they did it this year with Poland and Portugal, they did it with Bulgaria last year... and each year we end up with less and less entries with any local connection and less and less with native languages... it's apparent what the juries want to achieve here... and now when EBU has given them even MORE powers.

I mean what point is it with EUROvision if you can only succeed with sending middle-of-the-road ballads or midtempos in English with little to none connection to your country's own music?

 

[ParadiseES]

The current system is AWFUL, the juries are not here to NOT vote for entries that could get diaspora vote, they are here to vote for the music without any thought about the countries...

And the juries this year didn't do that with the exception of Belgium with Armenia. Poland didn't do much better in the countries where they don't have diaspora.

 

[A-lister]

I'd love to hear your opinion on Igranka

Oh, check last years forum. The juries screwed them over aswell. They are a hateful, narrow-minded bunch!

 

[A-lister]

And the juries this year didn't do that with the exception of Belgium with Armenia. Poland didn't do much better in the countries where they don't have diaspora.

Huh?

 

[MrJadeEwen]

So in what way is it fair when juries in calculated moves put certain entries in the bottom, not based on the music/performance merits, but just to hinder televoting results and because they have a dislike for a certain country or genre?

The LEAST thing they should do is go back to the old system, now the juries are calculating the potential outcomes of televoting and vote totally unprofessional to hinder that rather than judging the music, and what is it fair with a bunch of people punishing anything local sounding in a contest that is suppose to be a celebration of all Europe?

That's why I said I think we should go back to the 2009-2012 method juries do lessen the diaspora voting and are useful to the contest and putting countries in a top 10 are a positive thing. mathematically a song could get 12 from every televote right now and come last.. that needs to change.

 

[Andreea]

It's more disturbing if there is a big difference between the jury vote and public vote like it was in UK regarding Poland’s entry, than to have a bang-bang vote like Azerbaijian vs. Armenia. At least there people were all happy kicking the opponent, (jury and public voted in line) but in the case of UK, the jury shot their own people annihilating their votes

 

[A-lister]

That's why I said I think we should go back to the 2009-2012 method juries do lessen the diaspora voting and are useful to the contest and putting countries in a top 10 are a positive thing. mathematically a song could get 12 from every televote right now and come last.. that needs to change.

Well, EBU doesn't wanna change it... this is their way of sneeking in more jury power... I think it's dreadful. It hurts the creditability when juries can totally ruin the televoting. I actually feel nothing for ESC anymore, if this system sticks I won't even watch next year because it's simply taken away all the fun from the contest. Too much politics and the viewers are treated like they are children, when fact of the matter is they are far more open minded.

 

[MrJadeEwen]

Anyways, as I've stated yearly now (and we see the results aswell), it's a MAJOR issue for a contest like EUROvision which is supposed to be a contest of EUROPEAN music that we have juries that punish EVERYTHING that is locally sounding... they did it this year with Poland and Portugal, they did it with Bulgaria last year... and each year we end up with less and less entries with any local connection and less and less with native languages... it's apparent what the juries want to achieve here... and now when EBU has given them even MORE powers.

I mean what point is it with EUROvision if you can only succeed with sending middle-of-the-road ballads or midtempos in English with little to none connection to your country's own music?

Poland had a cheap performance using sexual movements on stage with little musical quality, it's no surprise it was low with juries. Equally it's no surprise it got 12's from countries like Ireland. It was a televote friendly song.

 

[MrJadeEwen]

Well, EBU doesn't wanna change it... this is their way of sneeking in more jury power... I think it's dreadful. It hurts the creditability when juries can totally ruin the televoting. I actually feel nothing for ESC anymore, if this system sticks I won't even watch next year because it's simply taken away all the fun from the contest. Too much politics and the viewers are treated like they are children, when fact of the matter is they are far more open minded.

Fair enough don't watch then, no skin off our backs

 

[Sonix]

And the juries this year didn't do that with the exception of Belgium with Armenia. Poland didn't do much better in the countries where they don't have diaspora.

Yeah... no. : P
Norway 12
Ireland 12
Ukraine 12
UK 12
Netherlands 10
Iceland 10
Austria 8
Belarus 8
Italy 8
Belgium 7
Denmark 1
Macedonia 8
France 8
Germany 8
Greece 6
Hungary 4
Latvia 1
Lithuania 7
Malta 2
Moldova 3
Spain 5
Sweden 8
Switzerland 4

 

[A-lister]

Poland had a cheap performance using sexual movements on stage with little musical quality, it's no surprise it was low with juries. Equally it's no surprise it got 12's from countries like Ireland. It was a televote friendly song.

That's your opinion

I think it's bad when people won't even admit when the juries purposely voted against televoters NOT based on musical merits just because YOU agree with their taste.

So what if it was sexual? Spain and Ireland showed equally as much boobies, and that wasn't even meant ironical

It's blatant what the UK and Irish (and other) juries did to Poland, that had nothing to do with the music or performance... Cleo did great and it wad a fun cheeky performance... also the song is fresh and local... something that should be celebrated in ESC.

 

[IncognitoGH]

Not fair. The voting system is not fair at all.

 

[A-lister]

Fair enough don't watch then, no skin off our backs

So you like jury political voting then as long as it fits your taste? How noble of you...

 

[QwaarJet]

Poland had a cheap performance using sexual movements on stage with little musical quality, it's no surprise it was low with juries. Equally it's no surprise it got 12's from countries like Ireland. It was a televote friendly song.

Agreed completely. Some people seem to have a trouble accepting that the juries hated the song. It's very much a love it or hate it kind of deal. Or in the case of the UK televote, all the Poles voted for it. That is hardly fair either. That is pure diaspora that has nothing to do with the song.

The juries weren't exactly perfect this year, but they killed the really cheap songs and rewarded quality. That is what they are there to do. I don't believe they are all "Europhobes".

A-Lister, you keep saying that Cleo did well and the performance was fun, but that is YOUR opinion, not fact.

 

[A-lister]

Agreed completely. Some people seem to have a trouble accepting that the juries hated the song. It's very much a love it or hate it kind of deal. Or in the case of the UK televote, all the Poles voted for it. That is hardly fair either. That is pure diaspora that has nothing to do with the song.

The juries weren't exactly perfect this year, but they killed the really cheap songs and rewarded quality. That is what they are there to do. I don't believe they are all "Europhobes".

A-Lister, you keep saying that Cleo did well and the performance was fun, but that is YOUR opinion, not fact.

Just because you HATE the song doesn't make what the juries did right... juries are not here to prevent diaspora voting, they are here to vote professionally and regardless of country... it is blatant what they did to Poland, but since you agree with it you'll pretend it was done professionally... plz... anyone that can put 1+1 together knows what was going on here.

 

[beki]

Montenegro jury had Hungary 14-12-7-12-10 in the semis and then miraculously had them 2-2-3-3-3 in the final???

 

[revallsay]

Well, I don't think that it was only Poles voting for Poland. We had a lot of votes from Europe and if those were only of diaspora then it would mean that more Polish people are spread outside Poland than in Poland... It would mean that every Pole sent thousand vots for Poland. TeamUK, how much was the SMS?

 

[ParadiseES]

Yeah... no. : P
Norway 12
Ireland 12
Ukraine 12
UK 12
Netherlands 10
Iceland 10
Austria 8
Belarus 8
Italy 8
Belgium 7
Denmark 1
Macedonia 8
France 8
Germany 8
Greece 6
Hungary 4
Latvia 1
Lithuania 7
Malta 2
Moldova 3
Spain 5
Sweden 8
Switzerland 4

I meant they didn't do much better in other juries, not in televoting

 

[Luki]

Yeah... no. : P
Norway 12
Ireland 12
Ukraine 12
UK 12
Netherlands 10
Iceland 10
Austria 8
Belarus 8
Italy 8
Belgium 7
Denmark 1
Macedonia 8
France 8
Germany 8
Greece 6
Hungary 4
Latvia 1
Lithuania 7
Malta 2
Moldova 3
Spain 5
Sweden 8
Switzerland 4

You do have to understand that most of these countries have huge Polish diaspora. Some of the above even have Polish people as the most numerous diaspora. Still juries did do their part in Poland's final result. But really who would've expected juries to vote high for this? :'D The problem is that most of jury members are in fact pop singers taught to appreciate only small amount of what can be called traditional genres and types. This is why delegation need to include versatile juries (for example in Germany rap artist Sido voted high for Germany and low for Austria). That is the main problem.