KAZAKHSTAN 2014 - not taking part
- Thread starter escYOUnited
- Start date
- Watchers 13
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
We need to have a thread named "Fun with A-Lister" where everybody can argue with him on different issues
I have my own arguments, i am 100% pro Kazakhstan in Eurovision. Why?
1. In case it wins i can easily go there by car or by train, cheap and fast.
2. I got used to starting watching ESC at 1 am and ending watching it when sun is already rising, so i don't care about the time difference
3. It's cheap to live and eat there!
4. It's something exotic and unusual to the contest.
Period!
I don't care who's in Europe and who's not, i don't care about cultures, i don't care about time zones, i don't care about languages, all i care about is music, the more music the better.
We need to have a thread named "Fun with A-Lister" where everybody can argue with him on different issues
I have my own arguments, i am 100% pro Kazakhstan in Eurovision. Why?
1. In case it wins i can easily go there by car or by train, cheap and fast.
2. I got used to starting watching ESC at 1 am and ending watching it when sun is already rising, so i don't care about the time difference
3. It's cheap to live and eat there!
4. It's something exotic and unusual to the contest.
Period!
I don't care who's in Europe and who's not, i don't care about cultures, i don't care about time zones, i don't care about languages, all i care about is music, the more music the better.
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Well i have nothing against Kazahstan in eurovision.
That's more something like Egypte, Qatar, Tunisia, Morroco, Lebannon i wouldn't like that much to see in the contest, even if they were interested, which i know they are not.
If a country decide to define itself as European then i have no problem with Israel and Kazakstan and Azerbaijan in the contest.
Well i have nothing against Kazahstan in eurovision.
That's more something like Egypte, Qatar, Tunisia, Morroco, Lebannon i wouldn't like that much to see in the contest, even if they were interested, which i know they are not.
If a country decide to define itself as European then i have no problem with Israel and Kazakstan and Azerbaijan in the contest.
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
We need to have a thread named "Fun with A-Lister" where everybody can argue with him on different issues
evilperson
Active member
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Hmm, I'm just noticing they have a very nice flag.
Hmm, I'm just noticing they have a very nice flag.
Verjamem
Well-known member
- Joined
- March 11, 2013
- Posts
- 3,996
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Kazakhstan is located outside the European Broadcasting Union area, so can't be member of EBU and participant of ESC, but Algeria and Egypt is member and could take part ? I don't get it, this is too complicated to my brain and world-view
Kazakhstan is located outside the European Broadcasting Union area, so can't be member of EBU and participant of ESC, but Algeria and Egypt is member and could take part ? I don't get it, this is too complicated to my brain and world-view
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
This isn't a matter of religion. It just so happens the countries that can take part but don't are Muslim. Morocco joined easily enough. To be fair how can you call it Eurovision if its not totally in europe? I don't want Kazahkstan to join, it will just be another country to the ex-soviet bloc, and if the african and middle eastern countries were to join then just imagine the bloc voting out of that? Also with more countries taking part then it would be so much hard for countries to even make it to the final? countries like Netherlands, Belgium, Bulgaria, Austria, Switzerland and Belarus Struggle enough as it is without adding more to the mix.
This isn't a matter of religion. It just so happens the countries that can take part but don't are Muslim. Morocco joined easily enough. To be fair how can you call it Eurovision if its not totally in europe? I don't want Kazahkstan to join, it will just be another country to the ex-soviet bloc, and if the african and middle eastern countries were to join then just imagine the bloc voting out of that? Also with more countries taking part then it would be so much hard for countries to even make it to the final? countries like Netherlands, Belgium, Bulgaria, Austria, Switzerland and Belarus Struggle enough as it is without adding more to the mix.
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
I see the most thrown around argument against entering is this "ex-USSR bloc", well I find it a non-valid argument tbh. The country lies partly within the European continent (unlike those African/Middle Eastern countries mentioned) and I think that is an enough valid argument for allowing them, when other non- geographical countries can take part aswell.
I see the most thrown around argument against
entering is this "ex-USSR bloc", well I find it a non-valid argument tbh. The country lies partly within the European continent (unlike those African/Middle Eastern countries mentioned) and I think that is an enough valid argument for allowing them, when other non- geographical countries can take part aswell.
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
I read every page of this thread and I don't have enough knowledge about Kazakhstan to bury myself in historical, geographical or social studies.
So at the risk of sounding naive, my only two arguments in favour of their debut would be that I love the Kazakh flag and that I'm really curious to know what kind of entry they would send to the contest, due to the country's cultural diversity some of you already debated over.
To me, there is absolutely no reason why Kazakhstan shouldn't be entering the contest. HOWEVER, except for Liechtenstein, I guess that that would be the ultimate reasonable expansion of the Eurovision map. We have enough countries to make great shows, if we add : Andorra, Czech Republic, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco (!), Poland, Slovakia... We would have almost 50 countries in. Full house!
Now, the main challenge relies on countries returning, not so much on countries debuting.
I read every page of this thread and I don't have enough knowledge about Kazakhstan to bury myself in historical, geographical or social studies.
So at the risk of sounding naive, my only two arguments in favour of their debut would be that I love the Kazakh flag
and that I'm really curious to know what kind of entry they would send to the contest, due to the country's cultural diversity some of you already debated over.To me, there is absolutely no reason why Kazakhstan shouldn't be entering the contest. HOWEVER, except for Liechtenstein, I guess that that would be the ultimate reasonable expansion of the Eurovision map. We have enough countries to make great shows, if we add : Andorra, Czech Republic, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco (!), Poland, Slovakia... We would have almost 50 countries in. Full house!
Now, the main challenge relies on countries returning, not so much on countries debuting.
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Thats where the EBU needs to be working. Instead of letting new countries join, they should focus on getting old countries like Poland, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Monaco, Andorra, Luxembourg as well as Morocco to return.
Thats where the EBU needs to be working. Instead of letting new countries join, they should focus on getting old countries like Poland, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Monaco, Andorra, Luxembourg as well as Morocco to return.
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
You want Morocco (a country that's not even geographically a part of Europe, let alone cultural part) in but not Kazakhstan?
You want Morocco (a country that's not even geographically a part of Europe, let alone cultural part) in but not Kazakhstan?
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Well, Kazakhstan is (like you probably already know) a former ex-USSR country, in fact it's been under Russian rule since the 18th century up until its independence in 1990's. It hasn't really been an independent entity prior that, more like nomad land. The Kazakh nation is a mixture of originally Turkic and Mongol tribes that established themselves in the area in the 13th century.
Being a part of Russia and then USSR (and that being the first "actual" statehood of the nation), the country has been influenced heavily by Russian culture and society. The country was also a target for USSR immigration policies, and it was immigrated heavily by ethnic Russians but also "forced immigration" by Ukrainians, Poles and Germans during the communist era, making the population ethnically diverse and for some time being the population was more or less equally divided by Russians (and other European people) and Kazakhs, it was also during these times that cities were actually built and the region got cultivated, hence the major influence of in particular Russian culture.
Today the Russian part of the country has been reduced partly thanks to Russians moving back to mainland Russia, but it's still heavily influenced by Russian culture and it's accurate to describe Kazakhstan as an ex-USSR/Eastern Slavic/Russian Orthodox cultural and political sphere. Russian is still one of the main and official languages, and the constitution emphasizes on secularism (a heritage from the USSR period).
Well, Kazakhstan is (like you probably already know) a former ex-USSR country, in fact it's been under Russian rule since the 18th century up until its independence in 1990's. It hasn't really been an independent entity prior that, more like nomad land. The Kazakh nation is a mixture of originally Turkic and Mongol tribes that established themselves in the area in the 13th century.
Being a part of Russia and then USSR (and that being the first "actual" statehood of the nation), the country has been influenced heavily by Russian culture and society. The country was also a target for USSR immigration policies, and it was immigrated heavily by ethnic Russians but also "forced immigration" by Ukrainians, Poles and Germans during the communist era, making the population ethnically diverse and for some time being the population was more or less equally divided by Russians (and other European people) and Kazakhs, it was also during these times that cities were actually built and the region got cultivated, hence the major influence of in particular Russian culture.
Today the Russian part of the country has been reduced partly thanks to Russians moving back to mainland Russia, but it's still heavily influenced by Russian culture and it's accurate to describe Kazakhstan as an ex-USSR/Eastern Slavic/Russian Orthodox cultural and political sphere. Russian is still one of the main and official languages, and the constitution emphasizes on secularism (a heritage from the USSR period).
12Points
Active member
- Joined
- July 21, 2013
- Posts
- 1,205
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Same like AshleyWright, i think the EBU should focus on europe countries that weren't in Eurovision to return back, even if Kazakhstan really join next year, it will probably another neighbour-voting-neighbour country, then Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and other Central Asian countries will join, although i'm from Asia i disagree with Asian countries join.
I think the Asian countries should better join the ABU Song Festivals (it's the Asiavision with another name. There are 2 festivals, the TV one, and the radio one, the TV one is not competitive , but the radio one is), the festivals aren't as famous as Eurovision but with a lot of countries to join (and a lot of promotion) i hope the festivals' popularity are increasing .
Same like AshleyWright, i think the EBU should focus on europe countries that weren't in Eurovision to return back, even if Kazakhstan really join next year, it will probably another neighbour-voting-neighbour country, then Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and other Central Asian countries will join
, although i'm from Asia i disagree with Asian countries join.I think the Asian countries should better join the ABU Song Festivals (it's the Asiavision with another name. There are 2 festivals, the TV one, and the radio one, the TV one is not competitive
, but the radio one is), the festivals aren't as famous as Eurovision but with a lot of countries to join (and a lot of promotion) i hope the festivals' popularity are increasing .Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
I think if Asiavision gets enough publicity and it becomes popularlity then it wouldn't surprise me if the central Asian countries join that one instead. Or if countries leave Eurovision for Asiavision eventually.
Considering my comment was about the EBU should be focusing on getting countries to return then, yes?... As Morocco has participated in the past (all be it once) the EBU should include them in getting to return and not just exclude them because they're not in Europe. Kazakhstan however has no history at all with ESC. So shouldn't be taking part until after the withdrawn countries have returned. As well as this they should focusing on getting European countries to debut like Lichtenstein and Kosovo.
Same like AshleyWright, i think the EBU should focus on europe countries that weren't in Eurovision to return back, even if Kazakhstan really join next year, it will probably another neighbour-voting-neighbour country, then Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and other Central Asian countries will join
I think the Asian countries should better join the ABU Song Festivals (it's the Asiavision with another name. There are 2 festivals, the TV one, and the radio one, the TV one is not competitive
I think if Asiavision gets enough publicity and it becomes popularlity then it wouldn't surprise me if the central Asian countries join that one instead. Or if countries leave Eurovision for Asiavision eventually.
Considering my comment was about the EBU should be focusing on getting countries to return then, yes?... As Morocco has participated in the past (all be it once) the EBU should include them in getting to return and not just exclude them because they're not in Europe. Kazakhstan however has no history at all with ESC. So shouldn't be taking part until after the withdrawn countries have returned. As well as this they should focusing on getting European countries to debut like Lichtenstein and Kosovo.
12Points
Active member
- Joined
- July 21, 2013
- Posts
- 1,205
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
Please don't call it Asiavision, it's already have its name, 100% ORIGINAL
(say it with Lynda Woodruff's style), it's a serious business for me (which i don't know why). And actually this year Kyrgyzstan is joining the Festival, along with Brunei, Thailand, and Iran, i really don't know why a country such like Iran wanna join the Song Festival, i wonder??????
Please don't call it Asiavision, it's already have its name, 100% ORIGINAL
(say it with Lynda Woodruff's style), it's a serious business for me (which i don't know why). And actually this year Kyrgyzstan is joining the Festival, along with Brunei, Thailand, and Iran, i really don't know why a country such like Iran wanna join the Song Festival, i wonder??????
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
I see, but Morocco barely has any history with ESC (other than that one rare random time in the early 80's).
I just think it's a bit hypocritical to close the door to a country based on some sort of argument that they're not a part of Europe, but open the door to a country that isn't a part of Europe at all.
Kosovo would be controversial since some participants doesn't even recognizes it as an independent state.
I see, but Morocco barely has any history with ESC (other than that one rare random time in the early 80's).
I just think it's a bit hypocritical to close the door to a country based on some sort of argument that they're not a part of Europe, but open the door to a country that isn't a part of Europe at all.
Kosovo would be controversial since some participants doesn't even recognizes it as an independent state.
A-lister
Veteran
- Joined
- December 28, 2009
- Posts
- 32,825
Re: KAZAKHSTAN 2014
I agree that EBU should focus on getting European countries returning first and foremost, but I wouldn't close the door to a Kazakh debut either though. My argument for Kazakhstan joining is mostly a geographical one, since it has a geographical European part (more so than some countries already taking part) and therefor it would be, imo, hypocritical to exclude it and in the meantime allow non-European states to enter.
Also, Kazakhstan already takes part as part of Europe in different international events, unlike those other countries you mentioned.
As for the other Central Asian countries, I wouldn't like them to enter, simply because they don't even have any geographical part of Europe. They could enter ABU instead, so in that sense I agree. But this thread is about Kazakhstan though.
Same like AshleyWright, i think the EBU should focus on europe countries that weren't in Eurovision to return back, even if Kazakhstan really join next year, it will probably another neighbour-voting-neighbour country, then Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan and other Central Asian countries will join
I think the Asian countries should better join the ABU Song Festivals (it's the Asiavision with another name. There are 2 festivals, the TV one, and the radio one, the TV one is not competitive
I agree that EBU should focus on getting European countries returning first and foremost, but I wouldn't close the door to a Kazakh debut either though. My argument for Kazakhstan joining is mostly a geographical one, since it has a geographical European part (more so than some countries already taking part) and therefor it would be, imo, hypocritical to exclude it and in the meantime allow non-European states to enter.
Also, Kazakhstan already takes part as part of Europe in different international events, unlike those other countries you mentioned.
As for the other Central Asian countries, I wouldn't like them to enter, simply because they don't even have any geographical part of Europe. They could enter ABU instead, so in that sense I agree. But this thread is about Kazakhstan though.