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Cheating in Eurovision voting

Matt

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If that's the case it's a grave violation of EBU rules warranting a one-year ban. I'm not sure it happened though, can any of our Russian members give us more information?


I doubt that happened otherwise the media would have picked up on that by now. Otherwise Russia would be in big trouble. Then again, didn't they want tatu do the same back in 2003?
 

Trece

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dunno where to post this, but there have been rumours about Russia not airing the Finnish performance during the finale (because of the lesbian kiss)???

LOL i watched ESC exactly on 1st Russian Channel (main channel) which translated ESC this year and they showed Finland. Moreover commentators so many talked about it (not in negative clue) that it was annoying. + exUSSR always don't translate big Interval act before voting (I was even afraid that they will not show Loreen Interval act)
 

CypriotGirl

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About Azerbaijan's points to Russia that were not counted, they meant that jury and public gave 12 + 10 points with the new voting system (1-26)? That's what I heard today in the radio anyway. And that they should have given Russia 2 points and not 0, so this makes sense, that 12+10 was with the 1-26 system. xthink
 

GWTW1939

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I don't think Russia won the Azerbaijan televote. If I remember correctly they placed 2nd in the televote and jury and were suppose to get 10 points but the EBU believed there were outside forces influencing the jury so they completely took away the 2nd place jury vote which resulted in a big fat zero! Combine that zero with the 2nd place televote and Azerbaijan's other marks Russia got a grand total ZERO points. Hope I made any sense.

It appears the EBU had no hard proof of actual corruption between the Russia and Azerbaijan juries so taking away their points was based on nothing but suspicion.
 

Jeansy

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I don't think Russia won the Azerbaijan televote. If I remember correctly they placed 2nd in the televote and jury and were suppose to get 10 points but the EBU believed there were outside forces influencing the jury so they completely took away the 2nd place jury vote which resulted in a big fat zero! Combine that zero with the 2nd place televote and Azerbaijan's other marks Russia got a grand total ZERO points. Hope I made any sense.

It appears the EBU had no hard proof of actual corruption between the Russia and Azerbaijan juries so taking away their points was based on nothing but suspicion.

The EBU send observers unannounced to countries to check everything is going well, it is entirely plausible that while there they saw something that concerned them so greatly they felt they had no choice but to remove the votes.

And I'm sure they have more access to evidence than we do.
 

FilipFromSweden

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Incanceration of journalists? Yes, there were arrested and released journalists in Azerbaijan in previous years, probably there are ones nowadays too. But let me remind you that we are by far not the worst about the number of arrested jounralists etc. among participants of ESC. When it comes to our media, I agree that TV is not that free but there are a lot of examples of our newspapers, magazines, online news agencies which are heavily bashing the government and its representatives. Btw the most readable newspaper in Azerbaijan belongs to opposition. Anyway you can not expect us or other post Soviet countries to be anything like Sweden or Norway only in some years, that is simply impossible!

Some locals were and still are forced to move because these houses don't meet any satisfactory conditions and the city is now under major redevelopment. It is not all about the area near Flaq Square but many parts of Baku. That is not about forcing people to be homeless, they get either new apartments in other parts of the city or money compensation of around 1500 AZN per sq m (1 AZN = 1 EUR). True, some people protest but then there is no other way to change things. The city needs to be redeveloped and get rid of slummish and wasted areas or Soviet commieblocks.

No idea about that gay story but let's agree that something like this may happen anywhere in the world, including Azerbaijan. In general, Azerbaijan, it is not such a gay friendly country like yours but nor it is a country where gays are beated or killed. There are a lot of gays who don't hide their orientation and nobody touches them. They have their own NGO, their online resources like Gay.Az, some bars and cafes where they gather together. Sure it is not like in Germany or Sweden but again for now you can not expect much from another ex-USSR country.

Ali Hasanov wanted to disqualify Sweden? :eek: Even I have not heard of it :? Man are you really Swedish? xthink

I guess you are right :)

Yes, Swedish text Loreen mitt i diplomatiskt drama | Melodifestivalen | Nöjesbladet | Aftonbladet
 

CC92

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It is not justifiable to simply delete a country from the voting list though. In that case they should of relied on the televoting-only-results.
 

GWTW1939

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The EBU send observers unannounced to countries to check everything is going well, it is entirely plausible that while there they saw something that concerned them so greatly they felt they had no choice but to remove the votes.

And I'm sure they have more access to evidence than we do.


And yet those 12 points from Malta to Azerbaijan that everyone keeps banging on about year and year stand! Does that mean people can finally shut up about that being corrupt then right?
 

Andreea

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I would like next year to have a single international jury, (reputable specialists, one from each country) and not 39 juries formed by journalists,producers etc. It would stop the arrangements between countries.

I don't want to say anything about Malta and Azerbaidjian or other "duet", I'll tell you about Romania and Moldova, cause I'm Romanian.
Moldova's jury will always give us 12 points, even if the song doesn't deserve maximum points. Of course they are specialists and they know is not correct, but they will give us 12. (this year we receive 12 points from the jury) If we have only one jury, these sentimental votes will stop.
 

Centrix

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I would like next year to have a single international jury, (reputable specialists, one from each country) and not 39 juries formed by journalists,producers etc. It would stop the arrangements between countries.

That's the best idea ever.
 

lowyby

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Can we just please ban Azerbaijan for 3 years from Eurovision? How much I love their entries, they deserve it, their bribing is toooo suspicious, 4th time Malta gives their 12?! Come on, Malta used to be one of the most fair-voting countries of Eurovision, bribing is all over the place.
 

Centrix

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How would they go about combining the results from the jury and the televote for each country then...?

We will have the results from televoting at the final and we will combine with the jury esult. 50% or 25% power to jury votes. It is less spectacular, but we will have a more fair result.
 

Galandar

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Can we just please ban Azerbaijan for 3 years from Eurovision? How much I love their entries, they deserve it, their bribing is toooo suspicious, 4th time Malta gives their 12?! Come on, Malta used to be one of the most fair-voting countries of Eurovision, bribing is all over the place.
Then why Maltese TV keeps silence, why other jury members keep silence, why EBU does not intervene in 'suspicious' Maltese votes? I think there is nothing wrong with Malta voting for Azerbaijan, it is just some people have to get over it ;)
 

Centrix

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Right, Azerbaijan is not the only country to cheat here. Malta, Spain, Italy... I guess almost all the countries try to cheat.
 
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@Centrix: So, in other words, you suggest that the results of the televote from all of the individually competing countries be combined one by one with the scores/results of just one single jury...? Frankly I don't know how well this could work >.>... But it could, possibly, make the juries less likely to be bribed or have them agree to send some (high) votes in the way of certain countries for no other reason but "We have such a good relationship, of course we'll give you good marks, the song be damned!". At the same time this could make them an even easier target to get bribed, not to mention that some members could try to influence other members to give more points to their own country's song, that and the whole thing just sounds rather messy.

@Andreea: Wouldn't that give countries with a larger population and countries with a more active/ECS watching population a rather unfair advantage though...? Unless you mean to combine only the scores instead of the total number of votes.
 

GWTW1939

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All people are biased in one way or another and a lot of them "cheat" in subtle ways too. Neither a jury or televote is ever going to be completely fair since human nature seem to go against that for the most part but you perform to the best of your ability and hope for the best. xshrug Yes there will always be problems but for the most part the last 5 years been progress, although lets face it the new jury system they made this year completely flies in the face of that. Who ever came up with that idea needs to be banned for life!
 

Centrix

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Well, these are things that need long discussions. But I think that will be more fair to not have countries who win with 25% or more the televoting and to recieve 1 point or even zero points. That can't be fair. The jury apeared again to stop "the same 12 point always". But now we have jury who has to much power, even to eliminate a country who win 25% from all televotes. This new system sucks and should be changed.
 

Andreea

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@Andreea: Wouldn't that give countries with a larger population and countries with a more active/ECS watching population a rather unfair advantage though...? Unless you mean to combine only the scores instead of the total number of votes.

exactly, I meant that each country will tell the televoting results (the score), so will have a public clasament and another clasament decided by the international jury. The two combined will give us the final score.

It would be more transparent. In our national selection, we had televoting and jury's vote. Each member of the jury had to tell his votes.
 
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