Voting and the jury role in it

[SuperGirl]

1. No one complained when Italy was 2nd in 2011 only because of the juries. This time it was Sweden's turn to have them on our side.
2. Jury should still exist. It's a huge part of ESC history. There were only juries in a long time. Why are they so disliked now? I think only juries has bigger part in esc history than the televoting.
3. Juries are needed to keep down diaspora voting.
4. To you who dismiss the jury voting and Sweden's win: do you think all winners with only juries are crap and worthless too?

 

[Gera11]

1. No one complained when Italy was 2nd in 2011 only because of the juries. This time it was Sweden's turn to have them on our side.
2. Jury should still exist. It's a huge part of ESC history. There were only juries in a long time. Why are they so disliked now? I think only juries has bigger part in esc history than the televoting.
3. Juries are needed to keep down diaspora voting.
4. To you who dismiss the jury voting and Sweden's win: do you think all winners with only juries are crap and worthless too?

2. Yeah, but the current jury feels totally..amateur
3. Some are making diaspora worse. Or they hate-voting
4. What I feel is that they think jury vote as a minority vote. But for gods' sake, it's legally 50% of the votes, just like the televote. I can't see why is not a legitime winner. And it's not like the televote put him in the bottom or something. Sweden was one of the favourites. So, let's say, i was something like 75% which is more than legitime.

PS: Just thought of that. We don't know how many people voted in televote. So the 12 in Germany and the 12 in Russia are quite..dunno, not equal in my eyes.

 

[Alaska49]

2011 had the old 50/50 split and therefore italy didn't win jury at the expense of random jurors unnaturally bringing other entries down. the situations are not comparable. this didn't even start this year. have you checked azerbaijan and armenia's jury votes last year? all the bookies favourites were put in their last places, lol. they are becoming increasingly more aware of their power in this new system and this year was the first year where we see it going strange ways.

(ps: madness of love is my most hated entry in the history of the contest and you just made me defend its high placement. i feel dirty and it's your fault!)

also diaspora voting might be annoying but juries completely nullifying it with the new system is borderline xenophobic. they should be ranking songs based on their opinions of the songs themselves and not on what the televote is or is not allowed to do.

 

[Gera11]

2011 had the old 50/50 split and therefore italy didn't win jury at the expense of random jurors unnaturlly bringing other entries down. the situations are not comparable. this didn't even start this year. have you checked azerbaijan and armenia's jury votes last year? all the bookies favourites were put in their last places, lol. they are becoming increasingly more aware of their power in this new system and this year was the first where we see it going strange ways.

also diaspora voting might be annoying but juries completely nullifying it with the new system is borderline xenophobic. they should be ranking songs based on their opinions of the songs themselves and not on what the televote is or is not allowed to do.

Yet EBU and fans did nothing. That annoys me the most today. Because we needed a case like this to make people angry on the system. It's like " if it doesn't affect me and my favourites, it's ok" but when it happens, "let it be fire".

 

[SuperGirl]

I want to add: juries are also needed to give all entries chance no matter what running order they have. Do really people think the televoting resultat would look like this IF Sweden and Italy switched running order?

 

[Gera11]

I want to add: juries are also needed to give all entries chance no matter what running order they have. Do really people think the televoting resultat would look like this IF Sweden and Italy switched running order?

Probably not, because I've seen some casuals tweeting that they turned the TVs when Hungary was singing, so missing the whole first half Or worse, they've heard only Italy -.-

 

[Alaska49]

austria won the televote last year after being the 11th country to perform.

also, i repeat: juries should be voting based on their opinions on the songs and not counteract perceived televote biases with other, opposite biases.

 

[Gera11]

austria won the televote last year after being the 11th country to perform.

also, i repeat: juries should be voting based on their opinions on the songs and not counteract perceived televote biases with other, opposite biases.

Jury probably voted based on their opinions on the songs, but what Supergirl was probably trying to say is that the draw somehow affects the viewers, especially the one-ocassion ones

 

[SuperGirl]

austria won the televote last year after being the 11th country to perform.

also, i repeat: juries should be voting based on their opinions on the songs and not counteract perceived televote biases with other, opposite biases.

yeah because the televoting is so unbiased and fair right?

 

[SuperGirl]

Jury probably voted based on their opinions on the songs, but what Supergirl was probably trying to say is that the draw somehow affects the viewers, especially the one-ocassion ones

Yes it is what I meant.

 

[Dante]

I don't think we could ever have a fair competition, especially at this level. I still believe that good or bad, we should have 100% televoting, after all, political or not, we are the ones watching, because of us ESC keeps on going. Maybe we're blind, have bad taste in music, like to vote for neighbours, but after all this is who we are and what we want. We always complain about it, but the reality is that we're ok with it.

A thing that keeps on annoying me is the weighting of votes. 5 points from San Marino cannot have the same power to influence the board as 5 points from a bigger country.

 

[aletem]

1. No one complained when Italy was 2nd in 2011 only because of the juries. This time it was Sweden's turn to have them on our side.
2. Jury should still exist. It's a huge part of ESC history. There were only juries in a long time. Why are they so disliked now? I think only juries has bigger part in esc history than the televoting.
3. Juries are needed to keep down diaspora voting.
4. To you who dismiss the jury voting and Sweden's win: do you think all winners with only juries are crap and worthless too?

You are comparing bricks with oranges. Sweden (as much as I really liked "Popular" and would have made a much better winner than the Azeri duo) didn't won the televote back in 2011. And also Italy didn't end up being the winner at the end. It was the televoting winner (ended second with the jury) that won the contest.
This year, Italy stormed the televoting and Sweden was not even second with the televote.
Juries should exist, however Bjorkman's influence in the contest should vanish! He can meddle and masturbate with MF all he wants, he should not put his fingers in Eurovision...simple as that

 

[SuperGirl]

You are comparing bricks with oranges. Sweden (as much as I really liked "Popular" and would have made a much better winner than the Azeri duo) didn't won the televote back in 2011. And also Italy didn't end up being the winner at the end. It was the televoting winner (ended second with the jury) that won the contest.
This year, Italy stormed the televoting and Sweden was not even second with the televote.
Juries should exist, however Bjorkman's influence in the contest should vanish! He can meddle and masturbate with MF all he wants, he should not put his fingers in Eurovision...simple as that

No and Italy wasn't even in top 3 in jury voting. How are they the real winners then?? The rules are televoting + jury. All countries agreed with this.

 

[blue00eyes]

After this year I can easily turn from an ESC fan to a hater. I give this contest one last chance next year.
It's so pointless to watch it and vote ..

 

[LoveHate]

My biggest issue with the juries is the way jury- and televotes are combined. The way it is now, juries have more power than televoters. Televoters vote for their favorite/favorites, but jury members get to rank all songs. Therefore they have the possibility to downvote certain entries. Haven't seen the split votes from the final yet, but Lithuanias 0 points to Russia has to be a prime example of a jury sabotaging an entry by deliberately ranking it very low. Also the Finnish entry in semi 1: 10th in televotes, 16th according to juries, 16th position overall.

Only the jury top-10 should affect the overall outcome, and 11th position and onwards should all be regarded as 11th position. If a jury buries an entry in the 20's there is no way it will receive points. Not even with 50 % of the televotes.

 

[JamieBrown]

I could live with juries as long as they won't change the finalists and the winner. The countries that come Top 10 in televoting should become the chance to perform a 2nd time and show their song to all of Europe and the winner is the song everyone remembers in the future. Normal viewers won't remember that horrible voiced albanian girl would've made 10th or whatever. But 'Heroes' is set as the winner for all time now and Italy should be on that place as the crowd obviously wanted it.

 

[Mannone]

Another problem is the long-term effects that jury voting has on entries sent by countries. Sweden is the prime example of always trying to send a song that will "fit" the ideal model of a modern entry (the "expert"-taste). By simply knowing that the juries have this impact, the juries actually shrink the contest towards the standard. Seen this way, the call for diversity becomes an illusion. Experts never want diversity, they prefer the modern ideal which is a modern pop song. Italy can forget to win if they send opera singers. It wont work when (to a large extent self-appointed) "experts" on modern music is going to vote. Televoters at least do not have the "expert" duty when laying their judgements, and so are less predictable.

 

[Helloworld]

Can someone tell me where to find the detailed, split votes of the grand final? They don't seem to be on the website like they were last year.

 

[Mii11]

I agree with Mannone. I do not think that e.g. Lordi would have won the contest if it has participated this year. The way that Portugal in 2014, Poland in 2014 and (although to a smaller degree) in 2015, Czech Republic and Italy this year is awful. I aldo think that the fact that juries influence the final result also contributes to lack of non-English in the contest.

 

[FilipFromSweden]

Apparently, the jury votes from Montenegro and Macedonia was discounted and only the televotes we're used

http://www.eurovision.tv/page/news?id=full_voting_results_revealed_by_the_ebu