Austria AUSTRIA 2014 - Conchita Wurst - Rise like a Phoenix
- Thread starter escYOUnited
- Start date
- Watchers 40
The skater won the entire event, like Conchita 
Conchita has tons of fans in Russia, and they are louder and prouder than others. They own youtube channels with basically every single Conchita footage that is out there. And RLAP is just a song that works for Russians, a bold big ballad with an amazing climax.
Conchita has tons of fans in Russia, and they are louder and prouder than others. They own youtube channels with basically every single Conchita footage that is out there. And RLAP is just a song that works for Russians, a bold big ballad with an amazing climax.
lavieenrose
Albania Superstar
I was here just because I was curious how bad it was compared to PKN, and instead I just started laughing about how ludicrous the early reactions look in hindsight. "Can't pull off a big ballad." Ha.
Dante
Active member
The skater won the entire event, like Conchita
Conchita has tons of fans in Russia, and they are louder and prouder than others. They own youtube channels with basically every single Conchita footage that is out there. And RLAP is just a song that works for Russians, a bold big ballad with an amazing climax.
I've noticed that as well, which is funny, thinking that their leaders try so hard to put people against.
Speaking of Russia --->
Nikkita
Active member
''He's a joke entry'' Conchita will be one of the greatest divas of Europe. Her new songs are also amazing.
Dante
Active member
I can't believe it's been a year since her winning...offff, soon she'll pass the thropy to another one, but I wanna keep her alive, as being the current, the perpetual winner!
or even better - it represented Europe for voting for a marketing trick.
sigi
Well-known member
- Joined
- October 2, 2009
- Posts
- 2,624
yep....same as 2007 when a guy with bad clothes and a female voice won for serbia!!!
That is half-correct, but again not quite the point I was making.
Marija looks the way she looks and it probably did boost the overall effect and made her win, but she didn't have any marketing nor a back-story of "fighting for rights" etc...........not to mention that Conchita is not a classic drag queen. He is a male but he feels like a female, but he also feels like a male, so he needs to keep the beard because he feels like a female. We had drag queens before, and that was and is certainly different.
To put aside the fact that I really don't understand how was Conchita actually "fighting" for anyone's rights, the overall impression is that waay too many people voted for her only because of that marketing and that is what I totally dislike, and that is why I am against yet another act with "a message" this year - Finland. Nobody (except us ESC fans) even mentions her song nowadays. And right on this place there was a very rude discrimination last year where people called everyone who didn't like Conchita and/or her song homophobes and stated that the entire Europe must vote for "the message". And I mean people who were politely saying that they don't like the song or just don't like Conchita as Conchita, not people who were trolling or indeed posting homophobic comments (for which they were sanctioned).
And that is the funniest thing, most people claim how the song is the most important factor here and then all of a sudden, the song is not important at all or, at best, it is not THAT important, "the message" is the most important. I seriously want to watch ESC and enjoy and vote for SONGS I like, because it is a song contest, I don't want to vote for any "messages" or hidden symbols in any entry. Song is above everything else for me. If that "symbolic" song is good, sure, I will be the first one to support it. But if the song is a disgrace (like the Finnish one this year) or if it is just not my cup of tea, don't throw piles of s**t at me for not supporting it, because it is certainly not a must to support those songs, and if you are tolerant as you say, then the least thing you can do is respect my opinion in the same way as I respect yours. This exactly is not meant on you, but it was a general statement.
That said, I don't think Conchita's song was bad. It was actually one of the better ones and her performance was also among the better ones. But the best one? Imo, certainly not. I don't think it won undeservedly, but I prefer to have a song winning and not messages or marketing.
That's all.
Dante
Active member
To begin with, I believe PKN this year is more a message for people from Finland and for those who actually are Eurovision big fans, I don't think their message will reach that far. Their presence on scene is not incredibly strong, and they clearly do not have an outstanding singer. I, personally, start to like them more and more, but I am not going that far into considering their song a winner. I like the approach, but giving the fact they are more underground, I don't think it'll have the same success as Conchita had. Apart from a far much better voice, interesting performance and so on, she also had a song that appealed to the vast majority.
You're right in a way, but I also believe that the song is not everything. It's not a radio show, you cannot deny that other things matter as well. I do care about the stage performance and everything else,because they create the mood for it, and sometimes they can drag down the song. Even if we do not want to be influenced by it, I think we are in the end, and we cannot abolish it. As for the message, I think this is the essence of each song. Music is art after all, it needs to have a message, I think a perfect song should be more than just some rythm and a voice. Sometimes the message can be delivered better with the help of the singer himself ( Conchita's case), and I do not see a bad thing in it.
Yesterday on a tv show of Rai 1 a contender danced to the tune of "Rise like a phoenix"
popavapeur
Well-known member
well i didn't give my opinion about it yet and even without reading the past pages i think that the discussion is about "deserved or not" win ? right?
Eurovision confession first :that's the second time in my life i voted for ESC. (Last time was in.. 2005-2006? don't remember, i have to admit i'm not a good fan) Of course i voted for Conchita. Now that's said :
I do think that Rise Like a Phoenix is not the best song, anyway taste differs and we could find someone who thinks that is the best. For me, Calm After The Storm and Undo were better. On the other hand i think that's truly dreamy to think that "only the song matters". Well, since the show is in color, it's not. The name of the contest is a little bit of a lie : that's not a song contest but a singing act contest. You have to be the best performer of the night. A good song fits in the things you have to make to win but imo it's not the first thing you have to deal with. Last but not least, music, today, in 2015 is not only "listening to something" anymore. You eat music with your eyes too, it's a part of the game. I mean, food, in gastronomy you have the visual first then you taste it, it's not only about putting stuff in your mouth and say "that's tasty". So, Conchita Wurst is imo the best performer of that night and deserves the win only for that.
About the other songs. I don't think that Calm After The Storm could handle the title. Why? cause it's fashion. As I said in another thread, when i take a look at the charts nowadays everything is about guitar, duets, little unplugged stuff, country-like music. If the song was a contestant in 2010-2012 it wouldn't end up so high cause it wasn't hype enough at this point. An Eurovision winner must be an instant "anthem" song, something who is not really "hype" but outstanding. the other one after Rise Like A Phoenix is Undo. (btw i love "calm after the storm" veeeeery much and i'm so happy about their 2nd place)
The problem i personally feel with "i don't like conchita" is this : of course you can dislike someone, i mean, that's your right but what bothers me is that you're disliking someone for who they are, do you dislike someone else in the contest who fits in the society? Do someone dislike Sanna Nielsen because she's Sanna Nielsen ? i bet people don't. I won't say it's homophobic but it shows a reject for something who doesn't deserve to be rejected (in my opinion of course) and for many reasons because Conchita is a drag act and people don't consider it as a "serious" thing. Maybe that's why people are disliking conchita, because you see the trick, you see that everything is "fake" because the persona is fake and you don't have this impression about Loreen or Emmelie but in fact : you don't see someone like Loreen or Emmelie in real life, they're not real, they're singers fitting into something they made to sell their music (for me it's kind of an art to create something like that).
Last, marketing trick. you're totally right. but you don't win a contest without fighting for it. As i said before, you vote not only for a song but for a performance lead by a character. So every winner is a marketing trick? of course they are! : Serbia's weird-daughter not really feminine? Russia's Douchebag ( sorry for that) ? Germany's teenage crazy girl? Norway's evil violin genius? and i'm not talking about the fake azeri couple, Finland, Hermione Granger from the woods Emmelie or last but not least Dark witch Loreen. Every winner is a character, they sell something and winning ESC is all about that, you have 3min to make people want your product. That's the X Factor. If you don't like it, i mean, you're in the wrong contest or you don't realize yet what the contest is all about. ESC is plastic music, it's instant consumption, it's glitter on a cake to make you eat it.
btw Rise Like a Phoenix does have a message, a good message, it's worth it. A message is always political (the contest is political even if you don't want to be it but again, you're in the wrong contest then. Just the fact we're countries is political) but i like messages who fight to be closer to the human rights all over the world. So yes, you can be against lgbt stuff (that's your right again if you think like that) but that's not a BAD thing that people want to live equally and say : yes there are plenty of people that are actually different and you don't really see it, we're here to show you.
For me, Conchita Wurst is a BIG winner of Eurovision, same category as Lordi, Loreen or Marija Serifovic. her win made me feel proud for who i am, it feet just good.Sorry for that biiiiiiig post, i had to make my thoughts on "virtual paper".
Eurovision confession first :that's the second time in my life i voted for ESC. (Last time was in.. 2005-2006? don't remember, i have to admit i'm not a good fan
) Of course i voted for Conchita. Now that's said :I do think that Rise Like a Phoenix is not the best song, anyway taste differs and we could find someone who thinks that is the best. For me, Calm After The Storm and Undo were better. On the other hand i think that's truly dreamy to think that "only the song matters". Well, since the show is in color, it's not. The name of the contest is a little bit of a lie : that's not a song contest but a singing act contest. You have to be the best performer of the night. A good song fits in the things you have to make to win but imo it's not the first thing you have to deal with. Last but not least, music, today, in 2015 is not only "listening to something" anymore. You eat music with your eyes too, it's a part of the game. I mean, food, in gastronomy you have the visual first then you taste it, it's not only about putting stuff in your mouth and say "that's tasty". So, Conchita Wurst is imo the best performer of that night and deserves the win only for that.
About the other songs. I don't think that Calm After The Storm could handle the title. Why? cause it's fashion. As I said in another thread, when i take a look at the charts nowadays everything is about guitar, duets, little unplugged stuff, country-like music. If the song was a contestant in 2010-2012 it wouldn't end up so high cause it wasn't hype enough at this point. An Eurovision winner must be an instant "anthem" song, something who is not really "hype" but outstanding. the other one after Rise Like A Phoenix is Undo. (btw i love "calm after the storm" veeeeery much and i'm so happy about their 2nd place)
The problem i personally feel with "i don't like conchita" is this : of course you can dislike someone, i mean, that's your right but what bothers me is that you're disliking someone for who they are, do you dislike someone else in the contest who fits in the society? Do someone dislike Sanna Nielsen because she's Sanna Nielsen ? i bet people don't. I won't say it's homophobic but it shows a reject for something who doesn't deserve to be rejected (in my opinion of course) and for many reasons because Conchita is a drag act and people don't consider it as a "serious" thing. Maybe that's why people are disliking conchita, because you see the trick, you see that everything is "fake" because the persona is fake and you don't have this impression about Loreen or Emmelie but in fact : you don't see someone like Loreen or Emmelie in real life, they're not real, they're singers fitting into something they made to sell their music (for me it's kind of an art to create something like that).
Last, marketing trick. you're totally right. but you don't win a contest without fighting for it. As i said before, you vote not only for a song but for a performance lead by a character. So every winner is a marketing trick? of course they are! : Serbia's weird-daughter not really feminine? Russia's Douchebag ( sorry for that
) ? Germany's teenage crazy girl? Norway's evil violin genius? and i'm not talking about the fake azeri couple, Finland, Hermione Granger from the woods Emmelie or last but not least Dark witch Loreen. Every winner is a character, they sell something and winning ESC is all about that, you have 3min to make people want your product. That's the X Factor. If you don't like it, i mean, you're in the wrong contest or you don't realize yet what the contest is all about. ESC is plastic music, it's instant consumption, it's glitter on a cake to make you eat it. btw Rise Like a Phoenix does have a message, a good message, it's worth it. A message is always political (the contest is political even if you don't want to be it but again, you're in the wrong contest then. Just the fact we're countries is political) but i like messages who fight to be closer to the human rights all over the world. So yes, you can be against lgbt stuff (that's your right again if you think like that) but that's not a BAD thing that people want to live equally and say : yes there are plenty of people that are actually different and you don't really see it, we're here to show you.
For me, Conchita Wurst is a BIG winner of Eurovision, same category as Lordi, Loreen or Marija Serifovic. her win made me feel proud for who i am, it feet just good.Sorry for that biiiiiiig post, i had to make my thoughts on "virtual paper".
DanielLuis
Well-known member
- Joined
- March 14, 2011
- Posts
- 8,605
This would have done even better than "Rise like a phoenix"
3