Estonia ESTONIA 2024 - 5miinust & Puuluup - (nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi

[ESC United Mod Team]

 

[BorisBubbles]

lol people FURREAKING out because of 5Miinust's staging. It doesn"t matter, GET A JOB FREAKS.

besides, the staging at eurovision will be different anyway. The stage during the SF was so tiny it barely fits six people.

So anyway, i am not worried at all about 5Miinust and Puuluup at all. If they're in the superfinal and it's a three-way again, they win.

Ollie is... boring to me but strictly speaking not a bad choice for the Estonians since he too will earn them a spot in the finale. Daniel Levi might do the same. But Puuluup and 5Miinust are the only contender that would actually excite me. They better make it work.

 

[Bsimmons]

What's there to really understand tho'.

Underlying humour of drug use, traditional instruments used (probably more value for Estonian voters). Even some sentences like "Pardikesed väikesed, kuid moonid on nii pikad" is untranslatable and full meaning is understood only by native Estonians.

 

[laululind]

I'm not sure one previous participation has quite gathered Ollie Uku levels of pity-votes just yet. But there are definitely some who might throw some votes his way because they think he should have won last year. Also people who like "nendest..", but think Ollie is a better fit for Eurovision. And many people just like his song this year too. Personally I don't even know which of his entries I prefer, they're about on par for me! So I wouldn't really be disappointed that he won this year and not last. But it would also be cool to see 5Miinust do their thing in Malmö. I guess it's the second year in a row where I like both frontrunners! Right now, going by odds and such, it seems 5Miinust might have the edge.. but it's certainly not a done deal like EL 2018 or 2015.

Wonder when we get the final running order! Not that it makes a huge difference in a 10 song final I guess. Personally, I'd do something like this..

Brother Apollo "Bad Boy"
Nele-Liis Vaiksoo "Käte ümber jää"
Peter Põder "Korra veel"
Anet Vaikmaa "Serotoniin"
Daniel Levi "Over The Moon"
Ewert and The Two Dragons "Hold Me Now"
Carlos Ukareda "Never Growing Up"
Ollie "My Friend"
Uudo Sepp, Sarah Murray "Still Love"
5miinust ja Puuluup "(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi"

But considering how weird some EL running orders have been, I'm fully expecting all the uptempoes to be bunched together and the show to end with the slowest possible ballad, probably Nele Liis.

 

[eerik]

Real Eesti Laul was 2009 - 2015 when it was lead by Heidy Purga.

Mart Normet (2016-18) fucked up instantly by letting the wrong Pootsmann song through the preselection, which then ended in our worst Eurovision result ever. I know, I know, not exactly his fault, but I will never forgive it. He also turned Eesti Laul into an anti-thesis of what it started as, by adding random foreigners to the jury and putting way much emphasis on the Eurovision itself.

Skipped Tomi Rahula era (2019-23) complately, but hated his ideas and changes.

Already not a fan of the current era. The 5 prequalified finalists might be even worse than anything Rahula did. Actually, I should say that I am not complately against the idea of having prequalified finalists, but the way they did it is terrible. Had they accepted demo versions of songs as submissions, like in Purga and Normet days, that would have been fine. It could have been seen as rewarding those who had put in more work and effort to their submission. Had they given invitations/free passes to certain songwriters (without having the actual songs), like in the last years of Paadam's Eurolaul, even that would have been fine. But knowing that the same jury that chose the other 15 semifinalists, based on the final versions of the songs, already deemed 5 to be better than the rest, is just plain stupid. Plus, I dislike 4 out of the 5.

 

[laululind]

Well, I've some faint hope they might go back to two semis in the future, if funds allow. Doesn't seem like the automatic qualifiers thing was so much something they really wanted to do as it was something they came up with as a compromise to still keep 20 songs while only having one semi. Other alternatives would have been one massive semi with all the songs, like Latvia I guess.. but that kind of renders the semi pretty pointless. Or no semis at all and a huge final with 20 songs. Or cut down the songs to 15 or 10.. but looking at what the jury considered top 5, I'm concerned we'd lose all the interesting stuff if they did that and be stuck with 10 blandest tracks. So if the choice is less songs, or still 20 songs but automatic qualifiers, I guess I'd take the latter. At least this way, the interesting songs still get a chance to be heard & make the final. But hopefully they'll find a way to go back to the tried and tested 2 semi format next year, especially if the feedback/results for the AQ system is poor.

They were also going to play some songs that didn't make top 20 in the radio and everything.. but I don't listen to much radio so I've no idea if they have or not.

 

[eerik]

Eesti Laul was born during recession and austerity. Not having money is a poor excuse. How much did they spend on JESC that nobody cares about?

 

[laululind]

Well, the first two didn't have any semi finals at all so that probably helped. Also the '09 edition (and semis from 2011 onward) being studio shows rather than big live concerts. But yeah, if EL was a bigger priority, they could probably find more money at the expense of some other stuff. But then you'd probably have other people complaining that EL is getting all the money while the other shows are left with less. There's always someone unhappy when budgets are concerned.
I still say they should find some suitable studio and go back to pre-recorded semi performances if need be. It worked for years after all.

I guess you'd need to have inside ERR information to know how much the JESC participation cost and if they had sponsors and why they suddenly decided to take part anyway. Maybe they got a big discount from the EBU, or had money left over for children's programming? Would be very interesting to have some insight but alas, don't have the necessary contacts.

 

[Paco Roca]

While 5miinust & Puulup may seem like the craziest choice, in a good way, while acknowledging originality, their song is cacophonous and messy. I prefer Ollie's Grunge/Alternative Metal. Ollie's voice reminds me slightly, this pleased me, of the lead singer of Nickelback.

 

[rasmuslights]

EWERT AND THE TWO DRAGONS â "Hold Me Now" // EESTI LAUL 2024 SEMI-FINAL

Authors: Ewert Sundja, Erki Pärnoja, Ivo Etti, Kristjan KallasAll rights belong to the Estonian Public Broadcasting.http://eestilaul.ee/

www.youtube.com

this is my winner

 

[rasmuslights]

Ollie is still too derivative for me.

 

[Ajeje Brazorf]

Let's not bring "Leto Svet" into the conversation if you do not understand it or the context around it.

Leto Svet was the culmination of Estonia's frustration with Eurovision Song Contest and our own pre-selection Eurolaul in the mid-2000s.

Main factors that lead to "Leto Svet":

• Estonia's poor performance at the Eurovision Song Contest itself. We went from constantly being in the top10 (and winning) to being stuck in the semis for years, with our results getting worse and worse each time. "Eighties Coming Back" finishing 21st in 2003 was a pivotal moment, forcing us to the semifinal in 2004. Vaiko Eplik, the frontman of Ruffus/Claire's Birthday, was personally labeled as "the guy who fucked up Eurovision". He was verbally and physically abused by idiots for years, even had to hire a bodyguard. That's how seriously/passionately some people in Estonia took Eurovision. It is kind of a miracle that Eplik managed to recover from this, having his most creative and successful years after all that.
• ESC rapidly expanding to more countries. Our years of poor results concided with a lot of new countries debuting at the contest. Those countries were mostly from Balkans and Caucasus, regions we don't really care about that much. This mean't there was even bigger competition for qualifying to the final, and there were a lot more songs that we did not like. Furthermore, these were also the years when countries from said regions did well. We gave 0 points to the winning entries of Turkey in 2003, Greece in 2005, and Serbia in 2007. Before that, the average points we had given to the winning entries was 9.7. With the exception of 4 points to Israel in 1998, the winning entry had always received at least 8 from us.
• Eurolaul being stagnant yet flip-floppy. "Eighties Coming Back" in 2003 was hated not only because of it's poor result at the Eurovision, but also because it was selected by international jury over a huge public favourite -- "Club Kung Fu" by Vanilla Ninja, which was dead last in the jury ranking. Backlash from all this made Eurolaul finally switch to televoting, however, after 2 years of televoting winners failing, they switched back to international jury, same story, rinse and repeat. So, in the final years of Eurolaul, Juhan Paadam, the our head of delegation and producer of Eurolaul, started toying around with the pre-selection process. There was a year when only invited songwriters could take part, eventhough the invitees were mostly people who had participated in Eurolaul for over a decade and would have done it anyway. For 2008, I believe it was 5 open spots + 5 invited songwriters. Priit Pajusaar, the man behind "Kaelakee hääl" in 1994 and "Diamond of Night" in 1999, was one of the invited songwriters who got a free pass to the final. He, sharing the frustrations of many other Estonians, gave us "Leto Svet".

"Leto Svet" was never a genuine attempt to be funny or to appeal to anybody in Europe. It was a "fuck you" to Eurovision and Eurolaul after years of bad results and frustration that came along with it. And it worked, the following year we got rid of Juhan Paadam and Eurolaul, replaced them with Heidy Purga and Eesti Laul, and we have done relatively well ever since. We have had as many top10 finishes as we have had non-qualifications in the Eesti Laul era. Our friends and favourites have also done well in the competition during that time. Our best buddies Finland and Sweden being the top2 and us being 8th last year was like a perfect outcome.

None of the Eesti Laul entries since 2009 share anything in common with "Leto Svet", nor is there a reason that there should be another one.

This year's Eurovision will be very similar to ESC2008, though: in 2008 we had the "Serduchka effect" with countries sending out of the box silly entries trying to replicate the success of that song in 2007 or to just say: "Europe, you voted for that? Well your taste is awful, now vote for us!" (ex. Ireland and their not so many Douze points), failing badly. This year we will have the "Käärja effect": lots of camp songs and out of the ordinary song, in National languages, trying to be as out of the box as possible to be successful.

That is why I don't know if 5miinust & Puulup will be Estonia's best choice this year, even though I kinda like the song, for example. Just imagine if they win, windows95man wins UMK, Go Tobann wins Eurosong, My AI wins MGP, Rim tim dagi dim or Babaroga wins Dora and they all get sorted in the same semi. They will fuck their chances one with the other and the only one which can gain something from this situation is Ireland, because it is on a NQ streak that in this situation can be broken.

 

[frankenstein123]

To me it's pretty clear that Ollie would maybe squeak through to the final of Eurovision and then pull a Jezebel. I just see nothing at all exciting or interesting in this. 5MIINUST x Puuluup are a gamble, but they are an exciting gamble. Anything could happen with the result, but they would be achieving it while bringing Estonian back to ESC, mixing together the styles of two beloved and very unique musical groups and showing off some traditional instruments and dance moves. There's just so much more here to appreciate, at least for me. Can't wait to vote for them in our Eesti Laul final!

 

[Paco Roca]

To me it's pretty clear that Ollie would maybe squeak through to the final of Eurovision and then pull a Jezebel. I just see nothing at all exciting or interesting in this. 5MIINUST x Puuluup are a gamble, but they are an exciting gamble. Anything could happen with the result, but they would be achieving it while bringing Estonian back to ESC, mixing together the styles of two beloved and very unique musical groups and showing off some traditional instruments and dance moves. There's just so much more here to appreciate, at least for me. Can't wait to vote for them in our Eesti Laul final!

I understand what you're saying. 5miinust & Puulup are a risky choice but can also follow the path of "Shum".

 

[BernadetteCydonia]

Also people who like "nendest..", but think Ollie is a better fit for Eurovision.

Oh come on that's just not fair now. When it comes to national finals, vote honestly based on what you support, or don't vote at all.

 

[henhu]

Odds for 5 Miinust and Puuluup are as low as 1.30 in some bookies. For reference, I think Elina Born & Stig Rästa had 1.40 some days before the final.

 

[eerik]

Well, the first two didn't have any semi finals at all so that probably helped. Also the '09 edition (and semis from 2011 onward) being studio shows rather than big live concerts. But yeah, if EL was a bigger priority, they could probably find more money at the expense of some other stuff. But then you'd probably have other people complaining that EL is getting all the money while the other shows are left with less. There's always someone unhappy when budgets are concerned.
I still say they should find some suitable studio and go back to pre-recorded semi performances if need be. It worked for years after all.

ERR's annual budget shrank about 10% between 2008 and 2010, and stayed stagnant for another 5 years before it started growing again. While making the cuts for 2010 budget, there were ideas of us pulling out of ESC completely, yet, during those "no money" years they managed to make the final a live public concert (like it was in the 90s Eurolaul before Paadam took over) and introduce semi-finals.

As you said, they could take the semi-finals back to pre-recorded studio performances to save money, though I appreciate that Rahula took Eesti Laul to cities other than Tallinn, might be the only good thing he did with EL. Karmel Killandi said that the current Eesti Laul is produced by television-oriented crew (as opposed to music business people like Purga or Rahula), so they should have a good understanding of how to produce it cheaply if needed.

 

[laululind]

Oh come on that's just not fair now. When it comes to national finals, vote honestly based on what you support, or don't vote at all.

No arguments from me! And I think there aren't too many people that think like that.. but I've definitely seen a few comments of that nature. 5Miinust is great but not for Eurovision, they'd probably flop, Ollie would do better. I imagine most of those people like both songs anyway.. would someone really vote for a song they hate just because they think it would do well? Who knows, maybe they would! But I think such people are a rather tiny minority.

Odds for 5 Miinust and Puuluup are as low as 1.30 in some bookies. For reference, I think Elina Born & Stig Rästa had 1.40 some days before the final.

I'd be a little wary about giving them such low odds. The juries still worry me here. Tried making a quick prediction for the final votes.. 5Miinust didn't make the superfinal.

Total-TV-Jury
20--08+12 Daniel Levi "Over The Moon"
18--10+08 Ollie "My Friend"
16--06+10 Ewert and The Two Dragons "Hold Me Now"
14--12+02 5miinust ja Puuluup "(nendest) narkootikumidest ei tea me (küll) midagi"
12--07+05 Anet Vaikmaa "Serotoniin"
12--05+07 Uudo Sepp, Sarah Murray "Still Love"
08--04+04 Brother Apollo "Bad Boy"
08--02+06 Carlos Ukareda "Never Growing Up"
04--03+01 Peter Põder "Korra veel"
04--01+03 Nele-Liis Vaiksoo "Käte ümber jää"

But trying to guess what the EL juries will vote for is a total crapshoot. Never would have thought they'd have Wingman second in 2021, or Bedwetters second last year. And we've yet to even see half the performances live. Guess we'll have to hope there are at least a few more adventurous jury members in there, willing to rate something a little more different highly too. It just feels like "nendest.." is the kind of song juries might dislike. If 5Miinust doesn't make the superfinal, Ollie probably has it in the bag, which I wouldn't be angry about either. But I'd rather both made the superfinal and televoters got to pick who they prefer, fair and square. Guess we'll have to wait and see!

 

[Franzilein]

Ollie's attempt from last year was one of my favourites among all national finals. My Friend ain't quite it for me I'm afraid, takes too long to lift off. BUT he's so good live and elevates the song a lot. Would love to see him at the ESC, Europe is definitely missing out on him

 

[lasse braun]

If 5Miinust doesn't make the superfinal, Ollie probably has it in the bag,

the possibility that ollie could fail to reach the superfinal is much higher in my opinium.

 

[Realest]

Ollie's attempt from last year was one of my favourites among all national finals. My Friend ain't quite it for me I'm afraid, takes too long to lift off. BUT he's so good live and elevates the song a lot. Would love to see him at the ESC, Europe is definitely missing out on him

Im pretty sure his Time will come soon, probably 2027-28.
But I fear not this Time.