nSc 227 : cOnFirMaTioN : DeaDlinE 29 marCh 23:59 cET

[doctormalisimo]

eNtRy SeNt We LoOk FoRwArD tO aN eDiTiOn In ThReE iCoNiC nAtIoNs

 

[Otto]

We are waiting for entries from the following nations:

Aimūlli Necluda

@Territrius @Judas

We also welcome reserve entries via PM: @soundofsilence @MiraShadowMan @Gera11 @Sultana

 

[Buranovskiy]

I see my nation on the list of debtors.
But...The application was sent this afternoon.

 

[soundofsilence]

https://nationsongcontest.miraheze.org/wiki/Nation_Song_Contest_227

 

[Otto]

I see my nation on the list of debtors.
But...The application was sent this afternoon.

Your entry was found, along with a number of others. This highlights the importance of reading the instructions in the first post.

The list of outstanding entries has been updated above. The deadline will be extended until 18:00 CET today.

 

[Deleted member 5361]

Public announcement:

An unusual request has come up from one of the roster nations who wanted their entry to be changed upon a WL nation's hypothetical debut. If the said WL nation were not to debut, they wanted to stick with their original entry. If they debuted, the roster nation wanted their reserve entry to be accepted as their competing entry.

We, as the hosts of this edition, had an emergency meeting to tackle this unusual situation. We decided to decline this enquiry unanimously, as it leads to an entry change past the official deadline of the edition, which is extremely unfair to other participating nations who have finalized their entries.

X

Host team

 

[soundofsilence]

What have I done now?

 

[Otto]

Competing nations:

1. Adamsburg
2. Afnia (Debut)
3. Aimulli
4. Akatskuki
5. Balearica Island
6. Begonia
7. Belvist
8. Biflovatia
9. Calypso
10. Cherniya
11. Cydoni-Gibberia
12. Dalisska
13. Denmark of Spears
14. Doire
15. Effiland
16. Elvaci
17. Endórë
18. Fervorosia
19. Fierraria
20. Grand Duchy of Stenci
21. Griffin Empire
22. Halito
23. Illumia
24. Insomnéa
25. Kamandé
26. Konthena
27. Kordavian Islands
28. Marcobia (Debut)
29. MatiMati
30. Moisantia
31. New Acadia
32. New Bander State
33. Öösingimäed
34. Orangualia
35. Papendink
36. Perryfornia
37. Rahasia-Diati
38. Redwood Republic
39. Reym-l-Dneurb
40. Roseland
41. Rumia
42. Sakuralia
43. Serenes
44. Södermalm
45. Svobodnia
46. Szimbaya Kingdom
47. Tamausia & Deltannor
48. Tanoiro
49. Tcher-Rachoi
50. Tir an Abhainn
51. Trollheimr
52. Ugaly
53. Vylkuzeme
54. Waiting Iist of Shelley & Nici
55. Xhuhmaxhuxh
56. Xochimila
57. Yaponesia
58. Yeto-Ya-Yeto
59. Zombira

 

[Stargazer]

Competing nations:
Afnia (Debut)

So did somebody else withdraw? We had five nations who had to confirm or else be kicked off and but they all confirmed. Seeing as Pen Island and Oussou Empire both announced their withdrawal before the deadline, Necluda and Marcobia got to join the roster regardless whether they sent an entry or not.

 

[Sean]

So did somebody else withdraw? We had five nations who had to confirm or else be kicked off and but they all confirmed. Seeing as Pen Island and Oussou Empire both announced their withdrawal before the deadline, Necluda and Marcobia got to join the roster regardless whether they sent an entry or not.

I hate to stick my neck out in anything forum related these days but my understanding is that Afnia sending an entry and Necluda not doing so would mean Afnia would debut. NSC, please angrily react to this if I'm wrong...

 

[Deleted member 5361]

I hate to stick my neck out in anything forum related these days but my understanding is that Afnia sending an entry and Necluda not doing so would mean Afnia would debut. NSC, please angrily react to this if I'm wrong...

This is indeed the case. We had another emergency call regarding this issue after Anna's post to verify our decision. We've gone through the NSC rules again just to make sure, and our understanding of the rule 2.a.5 states that Afnia is, indeed, the rightful debutee.

Similarly, Luke himself came back in my last co-hosting with Emre, in a similar fashion, without even being on the WL, solely by sending a reserve entry over people who were on the list that haven't done so.

Unless the rules have changed in the last few months (although the main rule repository isn't updated with anything new and 2.a.5 still stands), we think our decision aligns with the NSC traditions and how it's always been done.

X

The Host Team

 

[Luki]

I hate to stick my neck out in anything forum related these days but my understanding is that Afnia sending an entry and Necluda not doing so would mean Afnia would debut. NSC, please angrily react to this if I'm wrong...

This is correct, I didn't send an entry in 218 despite being first on WL and had to wait until next edition.

 

[Fearnavigatr]

No, Anna is correct, 2a.5 only applies to cases when nations are removed by missed confirmations and when the confirmation deadline passes.

In this case the nations have formally withdrawn by their own decisions, and when that happens the top WL nation is promoted effective immediately as per rule 2a.2. Reserve entries do not override this.

If it's been handled differently in the past, it's because the rule has been misunderstood. I don't mind if people want to keep doing it like that, I'm just informing you as the original author that it was not the written intent of that rule.

 

[Deleted member 5361]

Then it is bad use of language (No offence Jochen) cause it's not clear enough what it's implying. Especially if it's not been carried out consistently in history (cf. NSC 218 with Illumia). This pick and choose notion of where and to whom the rules (and interpretations thereof) apply is exactly what I am against of.

We, as hosts, are still of the opinion that Afnia debuts. We are not going to rob a nation of participation. Especially when they have cared enough to submit an entry (we sent many reminders, mind you) and is willing to participate in the edition. We can have a poll if needed.

In fact, I would suggest pausing the edition immediately and holding a poll to decide whether Afnia debuts. Until then, the shows won't be posted and the edition will be on halt.

Happy Easter Sunday everyone, I am logging off to enjoy some baked goods.

X

The host team

 

[Fearnavigatr]

Then it is bad use of language cause it's not clear enough what it's implying.

I don't really think so, the rule of reserve entries starts with explicitly naming the situation where it applies:

5. If a nation on the roster has missed confirming and is therefore subject of removal if they fail to confirm in the next edition,

I can go much deeper into the how and why of 14 years ago if you wish, but 2a.2 is the assumptive default of WL promotions, reserve entries were a fairly new concept at the time and was considered a special case.

Anyway, I do not think a poll is necessary, I think rule 6.7 takes priority here. If the host team decides Afnia will debut, then Afnia will debut.

 

[berlyda]

Anyway, I do not think a poll is necessary, I think rule 6.7 takes priority here. If the host team decides Afnia will debut, then Afnia will debut.

Yeah, I agree with this. Due to the historical ambiguity in how this rule has been applied over the years, the host team should decide whether Afnia debuts.

And just to reiterate, we're trying to avoid these kinds of last-minute polls. In this kind of situation, either the rule is applied as it is written, or if it's ambiguous then the host decides. If necessary, any ambiguity can be cleared up at a later date by rewriting the rule, following the proper rule change procedure.

 

[Stargazer]

No, Anna is correct, 2a.5 only applies to cases when nations are removed by missed confirmations and when the confirmation deadline passes.

In this case the nations have formally withdrawn by their own decisions, and when that happens the top WL nation is promoted effective immediately regardless of where we are in an edition as per rule 2a.2. Reserve entries do not override this.

If it's been handled differently in the past, it's because the rule has been misunderstood. I don't mind if people want to keep doing it like that, I'm just informing you as the original author that it was not the written intent of that rule.

I knew I hadn't gone crazy and misinterpreted the rules all these years! There have always been two ways of joining the roster, at least in all the years I've been a part of this contest. Those that join before the deadline and those that join after the deadline.

If the community would prefer to let Afnia debut as well because of this misinterpretation, I guess we will have 61 roster nations then for a while until the next withdrawal.

 

[soundofsilence]

Hallelujah
I'm debuting!?

 

[Deleted member 5361]

Glad we're all on the same page. I see no reason why this entry shouldn't be accepted. Letting a nation debut without a competing entry would basically be a waste of roster space when there are nations who "show up". Afnia has shown their will to participate and that should be honored.

Donatella VERSACE

 

[Stargazer]

Glad we're all on the same page. I see no reason why this entry shouldn't be accepted. Letting a nation debut without a competing entry would basically be a waste of roster space when there are nations who "show up". Afnia has shown their will to participate and that should be honored.

Donatella VERSACE

Seeing as I wasn't able to update the roster until the last day of confirmation, that didn't give Necluda a lot of hours to even know they have made it to the roster. I'm willing to agree that Afnia can also debut due to this mix up, but not at the expense of Necluda since they've joined the roster fair and square according to the rules. So we have three debuting nations, just that one of them failed to confirm.