Kosovo KOSOVO 2024 - not taking part

[ESC United Mod Team]

 

[Marcos C]

I understand that a possible debut of Kosovo may upset very few counties but it's not an "apocalypse type of scenario" a few fans try to label it. Eventually, most countries Will cope with it... even Spain.

I hope you're right.

 

[MopManMoss]

"Wales" is a country that is part of the United Kingdom. Thus, it's not like "Bavaria" (which is a federal state of Germany).

Anyway, my point remains the same: Spain willingly participated in a Eurovision contest in which a country like "Wales" which is not independent (= part of the UK) took part.

Even if a country doesn't recognise Kosovo as a country it's still an entity of another country - called "Kosovo and Metohija" (Serbia consists of Serbia and two autonomous regions like Kosovo and Metohija; and Voyvodina). Thus, countries such as Spain could treat Kosovo as "Wales" in JESC - an exception to the rule.. an "entity" which is autonomous/a country within a country and call it a day.

EBU events and "internal politics" are indeed two different things - that's why Israel can compete at Eurovision, Wales - as a non-independent country (JESC) - can compete at Eurovision and Kosovo can compete at a Eurovision-related event (Young Dancers).
Thus, I see no point of ignoring the status quo that more than 82,5% of the current participating countries recognise it as a fully independent state and for the other 17,5% per cent, they can just "treat them" as "Kosovo and Metohija".

Wales is not a country in law it is a region of the country of the United Kingdom it is exactly like bavaria its a religion of a country with a strong identity. Wales is not a sovereign nation and only entered jesc because until recently nobody in the UK gave a fuck about junior (as they should)

Wales isn't a threat to Spains domesric issues as it isn't a region seeking indepdence its never had more than a third of the Welsh population in support of independence its nothing like catalonia or Scotland.

The Faroe Islands can technically compete in junior because Denmark doesn't doesn't mean that they would suddenly seen as a real Independent country.

Wales and Kosovo are in no way comparable.

We are going round in circles its clear that you think Spain and other countries with internal border and seccessionist disputes wouldn't have any issue with the admission of Kosovo to eurovision despite the mountain of evidence we have saying otherwise.

 

[MopManMoss]

Spain voted against admission of Kosovo to The Council of Europe just this April which is miles more important than eurovision ffs

The Spanish broadcaster that represents Spain at Eurovision (rtve) refuses to acknowledge Kosovo as a nation during European football coverage

Wake up all the evidence is out there it will not just be Serbia that has issues and the EBU are smart enough to know this

 

[ESC94]

Interesting duel, too bad I don´t have any popcorn right now.

 

[Mainshow]

Funny - because I mentioned it as well: Spain just showed the name "Kosovo" in small letters but they let them participate/played against them.

That's why I think that a potential debut of Kosovo would probably cause the same reaction/treatment.

I really don't get it why it's so difficult to accept that I believe that a country like Spain wouldn't be withdrawing

The British government calls Wales a country but anyway - it's a constituent of a kingdom.

UK Government Web Archive

This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/geography/beginner-s-guide/administrative/the-countries-of-the-uk/index.html looked like on 8 Jan 2016 at 05:12:01

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Taken from the official site of the British Prime Minister:

The United Kingdom is made up of four countries: England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Its full name is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.

Great Britain, however, comprises only England, Scotland and Wales. Great Britain is the largest island of the British Isles. Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic form the second largest island.

UK Government Web Archive

This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page823 looked like on 9 Sep 2008 at 01:35:12

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Again, I believe that a potential debut of Kosovo will cause some commotion - but it will not turn out into 8+ countries withdrawing (including a Big 5 country like Spain).

I agree with you that "The Council of Europe" is way more important than Eurovision and that's exactly why I believe that the EBU should be pushing for a debut - since other countries should be more relaxed about this issue (Kosovo is actively taking part in sport events and other countries haven't withdrawn - including Serbia).

 

[HarryUK]

Funny - because I mentioned it as well: Spain just showed the name "Kosovo" in small letters but they let them participate/played against them.

That's why I think that a potential debut of Kosovo would probably cause the same reaction/treatment.

I really don't get it why it's so difficult to accept that I believe that a country like Spain wouldn't be withdrawing

The British government calls Wales a country but anyway - it's a constituent of a kingdom.

UK Government Web Archive

This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/geography/beginner-s-guide/administrative/the-countries-of-the-uk/index.html looked like on 8 Jan 2016 at 05:12:01

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Taken from the official site of the British Prime Minister:

UK Government Web Archive

This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://www.number10.gov.uk/Page823 looked like on 9 Sep 2008 at 01:35:12

webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Again, I believe that a potential debut of Kosovo will cause some commotion - but it will not turn out into 8+ countries withdrawing (including a Big 5 country like Spain).

I agree with you that "The Council of Europe" is way more important than Eurovision and that's exactly why I believe that the EBU should be pushing for a debut - since other countries should be more relaxed about this issue (Kosovo is actively taking part in sport events and other countries haven't withdrawn - including Serbia).

Wales was always a principality of the Kingdom but in recent history became recognised as a country within the UK as far as I'm aware

 

[MopManMoss]

A constituent country is not the same thing as a soverign nation Kosovo is not a constituent country it claims to be a soverign nation which 53% of UN Member states agree with

Wales is part of the country of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

 

[Mainshow]

A constituent country is not the same thing as a soverign nation Kosovo is not a constituent country it claims to be a soverign nation which 53% of UN Member states agree with

Wales is part of the country of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland

Yes, that's what I've been saying for almost two pages.

Spain was perfectly fine with competing against a "constituent country".
They have been "fine" competing against a "non-constituent country which claims to be a sovereign nation" before (by not using a capitalised lettter "K" or dropping the official flag [in case of Serbia]).

And again, Kosovo, Serbia and Vojvodina are consistuent parts/autonomous provinces which make up Serbia anyway - and I wouldn't place Kosovo and Vojvodina on the same level either because a) Serbia has no control over Kosovo; b) most European countries have officially recognised Kosovo as an independent country and c) Vojvodina doesn't want to become independent from Serbia.

However, it's interesting.. the words you use to phrase it... because Ireland, the UK as well as Poland and Germany officially recognised Kosovo as an independent country/sovereign nation and thus, for you and me, it's a sovereign nation 100%.

Eurovision; EBU =/= UN Member states.

Pakistan is a member state of the UN (a body RuZZia and Zhina in which are actively colonising territories have veto rights, btw) and doesn't recognise Armenia as an independent country.
Should we throw Armenia under the bus now because a UN members not taking part in Eurovision say so? Or get rid of Cyprus and Israel, too?

If almost everyone in Eurovision/the EBU get along with "Kosovo competing", we shouldn't hesitate much longer, in my honest opinion - especially since even "non-sovereign countries" were able to enter Eurovision-related events and competitions before.
Maybe "we aren't ready for it next year" (which is kinda ridiculous given the fact that Kosovo continues taking part in sport events) but eventually, it will happen - probably even in this decade.

 

[MopManMoss]

Yes, that's what I've been saying for almost two pages.

Spain was perfectly fine with competing against a "constituent country".
They have been "fine" competing against a "non-constituent country which claims to be a sovereign nation" before (by not using a capitalised lettter "K" or dropping the official flag [in case of Serbia]).

And again, Kosovo, Serbia and Vojvodina are consistuent parts/autonomous provinces which make up Serbia anyway - and I wouldn't place Kosovo and Vojvodina on the same level either because a) Serbia has no control over Kosovo; b) most European countries have officially recognised Kosovo as an independent country and c) Vojvodina doesn't want to become independent from Serbia.

However, it's interesting.. the words you use to phrase it... because Ireland, the UK as well as Poland and Germany officially recognised Kosovo as an independent country/sovereign nation and thus, for you and me, it's a sovereign nation 100%.

Eurovision; EBU =/= UN Member states.

Pakistan is a member state of the UN (a body RuZZia and Zhina in which are actively colonising territories have veto rights, btw) and doesn't recognise Armenia as an independent country.
Should we throw Armenia under the bus now because a UN members not taking part in Eurovision say so? Or get rid of Cyprus and Israel, too?

If almost everyone in Eurovision/the EBU get along with "Kosovo competing", we shouldn't hesitate much longer, in my honest opinion - especially since even "non-sovereign countries" were able to enter Eurovision-related events and competitions before.
Maybe "we aren't ready for it next year" (which is kinda ridiculous given the fact that Kosovo continues taking part in sport events) but eventually, it will happen - probably even in this decade.

Spain was fine with Wales competeting because Wales isn't try to secede from the country it is a part of nor is it a state that has declare itself indepdent of anywhere

Nearly all of Europe and the EBu nations recognise Kosovo as an indepdent state but as we have recently seen with Turkey and NATO is that it doesn't take a large group to delay progress

Yes Armenia shouldn't be in eurovision but that's a completely different topic

You and I are at a stalemate and I don't wish for there to be conflict between us as I like you and your contributions to this forum, I just do not believe that the admission of Kosovo would be a net positive to this contest despite the fact that I personally see it as a sovereign nation and that should be able to participate

 

[b4ld3r]

I don't follow football (or any other sports for that matter lol) at all, so I have no idea of what the process of Kosovo being let into UEFA and similar organisations looked like or how much controversy it generated in different countries.

But if I understand it correctly, for Kosovo to be allowed to participate in the song contest all member broadcasters essentially need to sign off on it? Maybe it would be seen as controversial in countries where Kosovo still is unrecognised (and perhaps more importantly, separatism is a big political question) for the state broadcaster to be seen as taking active steps in what could be seen as legitimising them? I'm unsure if these public broadcasters would be interested to drum up political controversy like that and risk their funding getting slashed after the next election.

All I'm saying is that maybe a country's public broadcaster signing off on inviting Kosovo to the contest might be viewed differently than the country's national sports team taking part in an international sporting event, in which Kosovo also were invited by the organisers.

However if it was up to me they would of course be allowed in yesterday, the more the merrier!

 

[elanyvx]

I don't follow football (or any other sports for that matter lol) at all, so I have no idea of what the process of Kosovo being let into UEFA and similar organisations looked like or how much controversy it generated in different countries.

On 3 May 2016, at the Ordinary Congress, Kosovo was accepted into UEFA (Union of European Football Associations) after members voted 28–24 in favor of Kosovo (and 2 votes invalid). Ten days later, Kosovo was accepted in FIFA (Fédération internationale de football association) their 66th Congress in Mexico, with 141 votes in favour and 23 against.

The countries that still do not recognize Kosovo are Serbia and Russia as well as 5 EU members (Spain, Cyprus, Greece, Slovakia and Romania). Russia is banned from ESC, Romania may withdraw and Slovakia actually is not here. 4 out of 7 countries remain.

After Australia's inclusion in Eurovision which has nothing to do with Europe, in fact in football it has its own confederation with the Asian nations after having been in the oceanic one for years. I would say that musically and culturally Kosovo has what it takes to be there.

 

[elanyvx]

During yesterday's match, which ended 2-0 in favor of Romania.

The match between Romania and Kosovo was suspended after 16 minutes, from the stands of the Arena Nationala in Bucharest the fans chanted chants praising Serbia: "Kosovo and Serbia united under the tricolour", "Kosovo is Serbia". Several smoke bombs were also lit and the police entered the field. The two teams returned to the locker rooms after repeated announcements from the stadium speaker.

ROmania-kosovo sospesa per cori inneggianti alla serbia

La partita tra Romania e Kosovo e stata sospesa al 16' dopo che dagli spalti dell'Arena Nationala di Bucarest i tifosi hanno intonato dei cori...

www.sportmediaset.mediaset.it

 

[elanyvx]

RTK revealed the 18 artists for Festivali i Kenges
The Festival will take place on 26-27-28 october in Prishtina

Festivali i Këngës në RTK - Zbulohen 18 këngët finaliste

Komisioni Përzgjedhës i Festivalit të Këngës në RTK ka bërë përzgjedhjen e 18 këngëve finaliste të edicionit të parë të Festivalit të Këngës në Radiotelevizonin e Kosovës. Pas një mbledhje katërorëshe, komisioni përzgjedhës ka nxjerrë listën e këngëve finaliste të Festivalit të Këngës në RTK.

www.rtklive.com

The artistic director of the festival, Florent Boshnjaku:
"It should be a celebration it should be a beginning for Kosovo to be represented at the Eurovision. I hope the time will come soon for RTK to become a member of EBU and so it opens the way for RTK Song Festival winner to participate in the "Eurovision".

 

[Mainshow]

If the EBU continues discriminating Kosovo and preventing them from debuting, I just hope that the winner of their Festival will get a slot as an interval act in one of ESC's semi finals (especially since it's going to be the winner of the very first edition).

 

[MopManMoss]

If the EBU continues discriminating Kosovo and preventing them from debuting, I just hope that the winner of their Festival will get a slot as an interval act in one of ESC's semi finals (especially since it's going to be the winner of the very first edition).

SVT are trying to shorten the shows not lengthen them why would they include the winner of a contest of a non ebu member country that makes no sense

 

[Mainshow]

SVT are trying to shorten the shows not lengthen them why would they include the winner of a contest of a non ebu member country that makes no sense

SVT invited an American singer to perform a song for a kids' movie.

 

[MopManMoss]

If the EBU continues discriminating Kosovo and preventing them from debuting, I just hope that the winner of their Festival will get a slot as an interval act in one of ESC's semi finals (especially since it's going to be the winner of the very first edition).

SVT invited an American singer to perform a song for a kids' movie.

THe EBU isnt "discriminating against Kosovo" Kosovo doesnt meet the admission criteria, you need to take up your feelings with the International Telecommunications Union as you cannot be a member of the EBU without being in the ITU and the EBU has no control over who is and isnt a member of the ITU

As much as I enjoyed Timberlake I dont want to see Americans at eurovision, the best interval acts are always just a showcase of the host countries domestic talent

 

[Gera11]

Involving Kosovo in any way would create way more trouble than it's worth honestly.

 

[MopManMoss]

We kind of had a Kosovo interval act in the semi this year anyway not that I remember anything of Rita Ora's performance and I was at the live show lol

 

[Mainshow]

Poor Rita Ora ppl here enjoyed her performance, though.

So it's the ITU who's discriminating Kosovo... oh well.