Bringing back the language rule!

[Mickey]

And I want the juries to be out, cause they hate languages different then english.

I did the stats based on 2009 and 2010 results and found no evidence for this. A quick look at the results from this year's final shows that juries rated France, Serbia and Italy higher than the televote. Greece and Spain had the opposite voting pattern.

 

[Yamarus]

I did the stats based on 2009 and 2010 results and found no evidence for this. A quick look at the results from this year's final shows that juries rated France, Serbia and Italy higher than the televote. Greece and Spain had the opposite voting pattern.

In 2010, Finland was 6th in the televote but 15th in jury voting, which made them miss the final. I agree that there's no conclusive evidence that juries prefer English songs, well unless someone can provide numbers.

 

[CC92]

^The point is the jury is biassed against ethnic/folk songs or in the broader sense unconventional/"risky" entries and these are the ones where other languages than English simply fit best. Jury might still evaluate their favourite genres higher also when they are performed in their native tongue but televoting will on prinicple not go for disney ballads or other hardcore U.S. stuff (jazz, country, blues, ...). And commercial pop almost is in English. In 2009, Estonia managed to send some kind of 'compromise', elements satisfying both jury and European voters but that is quite tricky and cannot be achieved every year.

 

[nikolay_BG]

In 2010, Finland was 6th in the televote but 15th in jury voting, which made them miss the final. I agree that there's no conclusive evidence that juries prefer English songs, well unless someone can provide numbers.

How about that from all the semi finalists only 1 song in language different from english qualified for the final? This country was Serbia (which gets usually big votes from the balkan countries and the balkan juries, cause they send easy sounding songs in serbian (which is really similar to most of the balkan languages (macedonian, bulgarian, croatian, slovenian...)

 

[Yamarus]

Sure, but I would blame that much more on the very limited number of non-English songs. Moreover, Serbia 2011 is a very very good song and it was wonderfully performed, I didn't see block-voting here.

 

[nikolay_BG]

The serbian song was ******************** and the girl sanged like Eric Saade. C`mon. From the ex-yugo countries Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina and Slovenia had the best songs. I can`t say the same for Serbia and Croatia.

I miss songs like Lane Moje and Oro from Serbia. I don`t like the last songs that they send TBH.

 

[Yamarus]

Albania and Slovenia were great, and in the former's case, the live performance was breathtaking and much better than the studio version. B&H was nice, but Dino's voice was not stellar. And I rest my case, Serbia 2011 is a very good song. Maybe not to your liking, but objectively it was nicely performed. Nothing exceptional, but you can't compare it to Eric "I'll dance frantically to hide my horrible vocal performance" Saade.

 

[CC92]

God thanks this still is not a singing competition.

 

[nikolay_BG]

Albania and Slovenia were great, and in the former's case, the live performance was breathtaking and much better than the studio version. B&H was nice, but Dino's voice was not stellar. And I rest my case, Serbia 2011 is a very good song. Maybe not to your liking, but objectively it was nicely performed. Nothing exceptional, but you can't compare it to Eric "I'll dance frantically to hide my horrible vocal performance" Saade.

Actually Nina was worse then Saade, cause Saade at least knows that he sings really, really, really bad.

I think the best vocalists this year are Maja Keuc, Nadine Beiler, Poli Genova, Anna Rossinelli and the guys from Belgium.

 

[AllThatJazz]

How many people in Denmark listen to danish music????? I doubt that many!

We do, actually Currently #2, #3 and #6 on our official track list are songs in Danish (and #8 is in Swedish!)

But as much as I would love to hear more native languages in Eurovision, I think that reintroducing the language rule would be a step backwards.

As Matt writes, the music market has changed - a lot of young Europeans mostly listens to music with English lyrics. A language rule in Eurovision will not be able to change that fact.

If the language rule is reintroduced, it will be far more difficult for Eurovision composers to get a breaktrough. I doubt that songs like "Fly on the wings of love" or "Satellite" would have been hits, if they were sung in Danish and German.

Bringing back the language rule would also give certain countries some serious disadvantages. In my ears, languages like Dutch, Danish, Icelandic and Finnish doesn't sound very beautiful, while e.g. French and Spanish does.

Not to mention the big advantage UK, Ireland and Malta would get (like in the 1990's - anyone remembers Ireland's three consecutive victories?)

For me, it's a question whether Eurovision should be a contest in popular music or a niche show for fans.

 

[Sabiondo]

We do, actually Currently #2, #3 and #6 on our official track list are songs in Danish (and #8 is in Swedish!)

But as much as I would love to hear more native languages in Eurovision, I think that reintroducing the language rule would be a step backwards.

As Matt writes, the music market has changed - a lot of young Europeans mostly listens to music with English lyrics. A language rule in Eurovision will not be able to change that fact.

If the language rule is reintroduced, it will be far more difficult for Eurovision composers to get a breaktrough. I doubt that songs like "Fly on the wings of love" or "Satellite" would have been hits, if they were sung in Danish and German.

Bringing back the language rule would also give certain countries some serious disadvantages. In my ears, languages like Dutch, Danish, Icelandic and Finnish doesn't sound very beautiful, while e.g. French and Spanish does.

Not to mention the big advantage UK, Ireland and Malta would get (like in the 1990's - anyone remembers Ireland's three consecutive victories?)

For me, it's a question whether Eurovision should be a contest in popular music or a niche show for fans.

Also add that the Soviet & Balkans votings will be more stronger than ever even with jury

 

[CC92]

As Matt writes, the music market has changed - a lot of young Europeans mostly listens to music with English lyrics. A language rule in Eurovision will not be able to change that fact.

Especially young people are interested in different cultures and excitement with authentic music. For those who are not, mainly ten-year-old to 15-year-old kids, there is still MTV channels and idol competitions.

If the language rule is reintroduced, it will be far more difficult for Eurovision composers to get a breaktrough. I doubt that songs like "Fly on the wings of love" or "Satellite" would have been hits, if they were sung in Danish and German.

Europe had international chart breakers in German and even in Romanian so far.

Bringing back the language rule would also give certain countries some serious disadvantages. In my ears, languages like Dutch, Danish, Icelandic and Finnish doesn't sound very beautiful, while e.g. French and Spanish does.

In my ears Finnish sounds beautiful, French pretentious, Medina's hits much more harmonious in Danish, that is why I bought the deluxe edition of her album btw, and almost nothing worse than a Dutch accent in English or another language (sorry Flemings and Hollanders!). It is all about opinion.

Not to mention the big advantage UK, Ireland and Malta would get (like in the 1990's - anyone remembers Ireland's three consecutive victories?)

You checked those were juries that had voted?

For me, it's a question whether Eurovision should be a contest in popular music or a niche show for fans.

Good point.

 

[Sabiondo]

Europe had international chart breakers in German and even in Romanian so far.


In my ears Finnish sounds beautiful, French pretentious, Medina's hits much more harmonious in Danish, that is why I bought the deluxe edition of her album btw, and almost nothing worse than a Dutch accent in English or another language (sorry Flemings and Hollanders!). It is all about opinion.

How about Greek, Turkish, Armenian, Georgian, Russian, Ukrainian, Czech, Polish, etc... hey had international chart breakers too in Europe..?? Do you thing that hole Europe will undertand also thorse lenguages as for chose the best song...??? Tell me if Dima Bilan, Ruslana, Ani Lorak, Kalomira etc.. will be well will succeed in Westen Europe if they sing in their languages

 

[Yamarus]

If the language rule is reintroduced, it will be far more difficult for Eurovision composers to get a breaktrough. I doubt that songs like "Fly on the wings of love" or "Satellite" would have been hits, if they were sung in Danish and German

I don't agree. In the language rule era, artists would simply record an English version that would be released on European markets. Would "Ding-a-dong" have won if it had been sung in Dutch? I happen to think so. Like "La Det Swinge" won in Norwegian, even though the English version enjoyed a bigger success.

Not to mention the big advantage UK, Ireland and Malta would get (like in the 1990's - anyone remembers Ireland's three consecutive victories?)

On this I agree, but only to a certain extent. Ireland's songs in the Nineties were *really* good and, IMO, only "The Voice" is a debatable winner (and even then, it's a great song).
Same in 1997, what song could've beaten "Love Shine a Light"? I *love* "Dinle", and would've loved to see Turkey win with this one, but I can see why they prefered Katrina & The Waves.

How about Greek, Turkish, Armenian, Georgian, Russian, Ukrainian, Czech, Polish, etc... hey had international chart breakers too in Europe..?? Do you thing that hole Europe will undertand also thorse lenguages as for chose the best song...??? Tell me if Dima Bilan, Ruslana, Ani Lorak, Kalomira etc.. will be well will succeed in Westen Europe if they sing in their languages

Not to go against what you're saying, but singing in English doesn't guarantee chart success in Western Europe. None of the singers you mentionned are famous or even known in Western Europe. Ruslana is a one-hit wonder remembered for "Wild Dances", that's all. And she sang it partly in Ukrainian at the contest.

 

[AllThatJazz]

Hi Yamarus,

first of all, I love your profile picture - I always cross my fingers for "Linda Bengtzing" when the participants for Melodifestivalen is announced. For me, she is the one and only after Nanne left the building.

Regarding the language rule, I've been doing some thinking - and when it all comes to an end, I disagree with you....

"Why me", "In your eyes", "Rock'n roll kids" and "The Voice" were all beautiful and worthy winners of Eurovision

But could you imagine "Rock'n roll kids" or "In your eyes" being performed in Finnish and still winning the ESC...

I couldn't. Am I wrong?

 

[94ayd]

What the hell does Finnish have to do with Irish songs... Most of the English-language winners from non-English-speaking countries sound way better in their own language, though ( 1999 is an example that comes to mind.)

 

[CC92]

Would Molitva have won in English? I am not sure.

 

[Yamarus]

But could you imagine "Rock'n roll kids" or "In your eyes" being performed in Finnish and still winning the ESC...

I couldn't. Am I wrong?

One cannot say, of course. Although I think it's entirely possible if the performer has Niam Kavanaugh's voice and charisma. Ireland just blew the competition away in those years, and it wasn't because of the language. And let's not forget the juries: they were much more enclined to vote for the same country twice, thrice in a row. If televote had been in place, I think it would've been unlikely to see Ireland win three times in a row. I may be wrong.

When it comes to the entries post-language rule, it really depends. IMO, 1999, 2000, 2003, 2004, 2005, (2010) would still have won in their national language (assuming a language rule which allows a few sentences in English, like it was allowed pre-1999). I think 2001, 2002, 2006, 2008, 2009, (2010), 2011 wouldn't have won if not in English.
I put Lena in brackets because I feel "Satellite" would still have sounded great in German (taking into account Lena's obvious charm and appeal to the public), but maybe I'm too partial towards her.

But in the end, these are just wild assumptions and I may be completely wrong because the ESC *with* language rule would have looked completely different (different songs, different tone, different styles)...

 

[amateur]

I think a rule like "A country can't send a song in a non-national language two years in a row" would be fine.

 

[Mickey]

I think a rule like "A country can't send a song in a non-national language two years in a row" would be fine.

Then the overall standard of songs would drop. All the best artists would want to wait for a year where they can sing in English and have a better chance of winning.