Australia and Sweden

[Pawhlen]

Australia was "only" 12th with the Juries because the Juryvoting-Rule was changed this year to damage Compromiss-Candidates who benefit every year by Discrepancies in the Juryvoting. With the Old Rule, Australia would habe been 8th with 104 Points which is still a huge Problem.

Have you calculated all the jury points with the other ranking, I really would like to see if they were any differences
[MENTION=14659]Preuss[/MENTION] - I looked at a reaction video from the press centre at Kyiv last year to the televotes to see if it were any huge applause for getting only in the televote, and it was only ONE person who applauded very much.

Compare that to when we get 21 points this year and ALL people in the press centre cheer like they just won the World Cup in football

 

[Realest]

Have you calculated all the jury points with the other ranking, I really would like to see if they were any differences
[MENTION=14659]Preuss[/MENTION] - I looked at a reaction video from the press centre at Kyiv last year to the televotes to see if it were any huge applause for getting only in the televote, and it was only ONE person who applauded very much.

Compare that to when we get 21 points this year and ALL people in the press centre cheer like they just won the World Cup in football

http://escunited.com/forum/threads/...ssion-Thread?p=1821318&viewfull=1#post1821318


Btw.. I dont say Juries must foresee the Televoting, but it would be the 4 Time in a Row where the Discrepance between Juries and TV is extreme with Australia.

 

[Pawhlen]

http://escunited.com/forum/threads/...ssion-Thread?p=1821318&viewfull=1#post1821318


Btw.. I dont say Juries must foresee the Televoting, but it would be the 4 Time in a Row where the Discrepance between Juries and TV is extreme with Australia.

Ok, but to their defense, has taken the contest very seriously, none of their entries has been bad quality if you know what I mean, and that´s why the juries often vote for them I think.

One reason why we get jury support could be the fact that we have a simular IJ in our national final, that is formed as close to how they are formed in the real ESC, and since they were full introduced as 50% of the voting in our final in 2011, we have always pick the song they have in their top (2014 and 2016 is the only years where the 1st place in the IJ vote don´t won MF)

 

[midnightsun]

In case of Australia I can only guess juries award them a lot of points to give the impression Australia is not hated by everyone. From a producers point of view having good rating figures is everything. But when you know in advance, many televoters won't vote for Australia because "Australia doesn't belong to a European event" (that's what many are thinking - not me btw, I like the participation of Australia) you have to do everything possible to keep the Australian public watching. So why not telling the juries to vote for Australia, keeping the Australian audience happy?! ... ;-)

 

[Pawhlen]

In case of Australia I can only guess juries award them a lot of points to give the impression Australia is not hated by everyone. From a producers point of view having good rating figures is everything. But when you know in advance, many televoters won't vote for Australia because "Australia doesn't belong to a European event" (that's what many are thinking - not me btw, I like the participation of Australia) you have to do everything possible to keep the Australian public watching. So why not telling the juries to vote for Australia, keeping the Australian audience happy?! ... ;-)

Still they got 6th and 4th place with viewers the first two years, if they send a high quality song next year and still end up in bottom 5 in the televote, then I will agree.

 

[lolita]

Still they got 6th and 4th place with viewers the first two years, if they send a high quality song next year and still end up in bottom 5 in the televote, then I will agree.

And those entries from first two years were actually really great, and last two years were maybe weaker, but still not horrendous.

 

[94ayd]

And those entries from first two years were actually really great, and last two years were maybe weaker, but still not horrendous.

Both Isaiah's & Jessica's performances were hard to watch/listen to...

 

[lolita]

Both Isaiah's & Jessica's performances were hard to watch/listen to...

Well, yeah, they were bad when it comes to whole performance and they failed when it comes to singing, but horrible means something different for me. In studio version, for me, those songs are average, I neither love them or hate them. I have heard much worse songs in my life, that was point of my post above.

 

[Dima]

In anything that’s subjective, there will always be representatives with more political pull than others. The closest examples I can think of would be Russia in Rhythmic Gymnastics, Although plenty of examples exist in other judges Olympic sports. Yes someone can find reason to legitimize the Jury’s love of the Swedish/Australian entries as of late, but there are more examples of how those two delegations hold more political pull than others, The fact that ESC has been modified to become an imitation of Melodifestivalen and the fact that 4 years out Australia has managed to make the “1 time guest” stint happen are good enough examples in my opinion.

 

[lolita]

One reason why we get jury support could be the fact that we have a simular IJ in our national final, that is formed as close to how they are formed in the real ESC, and since they were full introduced as 50% of the voting in our final in 2011, we have always pick the song they have in their top (2014 and 2016 is the only years where the 1st place in the IJ vote don´t won MF)

I am really glad that you pointed this out here, I think the same. xgood Benjamin received huge amount of 12s in the Melodifestivalen, from international juries, six times 12 points, exactly same number as Loreen. I always knew he would be in top 5 or maybe even top 3 of the juries, because we already talked here many times that his performance is full package overall and very, very jury friendly, and music professionals really loved him at Melfest, so it is understandable and logic that they will like him at ESC, too. I don't only get why all of sudden are people in shock and denial now, because even those people who strongly disliked DYO, were writing on this forum comments, that they KNOW this will work well with the juries, because performance is good enough for it, whether they like the song or not.

 

[LalehForWD]

In anything that’s subjective, there will always be representatives with more political pull than others. The closest examples I can think of would be Russia in Rhythmic Gymnastics, Although plenty of examples exist in other judges Olympic sports. Yes someone can find reason to legitimize the Jury’s love of the Swedish/Australian entries as of late, but there are more examples of how those two delegations hold more political pull than others, The fact that ESC has been modified to become an imitation of Melodifestivalen and the fact that 4 years out Australia has managed to make the “1 time guest” stint happen are good enough examples in my opinion.

I think the surprising thing isn't we and the Australians got high points from the jury, it's about we got so low in the televote. Both songs were solid pop songs and for sure didn't "deserve" to end up in the bottom. My theory is that there's a big difference in expectations of the show in different countries and the audience is also different. It could, for example, be possible the viewers who like pop are not watching Eurovision in many countries. A large portion of the viewers can be fancying the spectacular and fun rather than the music itself. Supporting the idea Eurovision is a genre of its own (read crazy or camp mainstream) and rejects the efforts of bringing Eurovision to reflecting the current sounds. I do not think it's an age issue, it's a cultural issue. So, in my opinion, the juries are not only there to balance the detrimental patriotic votes, they are indeed there to change attitudes among the viewers. An aspect that may annoy some but which I support wholeheartedly.

 

[lolita]

I think the surprising thing isn't we and the Australians got high points from the jury, it's about we got so low in the televote. Both songs were solid pop songs and for sure didn't "deserve" to end up in the bottom. My theory is that there's a big difference in expectations of the show in different countries and the audience is also different. It could, for example, be possible the viewers who like pop are not watching Eurovision in many countries. A large portion of the viewers can be fancying the spectacular and fun rather than the music itself. Supporting the idea Eurovision is a genre of its own (read crazy or camp mainstream) and rejects the efforts of bringing Eurovision to reflecting the current sounds. I do not think it's an age issue, it's a cultural issue. So, in my opinion, the juries are not only there to balance the detrimental patriotic votes, they are indeed there to change attitudes among the viewers. An aspect that may annoy some but which I support wholeheartedly.

Well said! xgood

 

[Lindon]

I think the surprising thing isn't we and the Australians got high points from the jury, it's about we got so low in the televote. Both songs were solid pop songs and for sure didn't "deserve" to end up in the bottom. My theory is that there's a big difference in expectations of the show in different countries and the audience is also different. It could, for example, be possible the viewers who like pop are not watching Eurovision in many countries. A large portion of the viewers can be fancying the spectacular and fun rather than the music itself. Supporting the idea Eurovision is a genre of its own (read crazy or camp mainstream) and rejects the efforts of bringing Eurovision to reflecting the current sounds. I do not think it's an age issue, it's a cultural issue. So, in my opinion, the juries are not only there to balance the detrimental patriotic votes, they are indeed there to change attitudes among the viewers. An aspect that may annoy some but which I support wholeheartedly.

xthank reflects exactly my belief.

 

[Realest]

Btw. I miss in the Threadtitle

2010:
7th with the Juries (66 Points)/ 12th with the TV (45 Points)

2011:
6th with the Juries (84 Points)/ 18th with the TV (24 Points)

2012:
5th with the Juries (97 Points)/ 11th with the TV (39 Points)

2014:
3th with the Juries (113 Points)/ 12th with the Tv (36 Points)

2015:
5th with the Juries (84 Points)/ 12th with the TV (32 Points)

2016:
1st with the Juries (155 Points)/ 9th with the tV (54 Points)

2017:
8th with the Juries (55 Points)/ 18th with the TV (0 Points)

2018:
5th with the Juries (93 Points)/ 18th with the TV (8 POints)


Btw. This Video was so disgusting to watch:

 

[Preuss]

Malta's done that well with the juries...?

 

[lolita]

Btw. I miss in the Threadtitle

Lol, I think it is not interesting for fandom to attack as much as Sweden. is the most successful country in the recent years, and whole decade overall, but that is why it is also the most hated country, sadly though. But those two things go always together in real life even- being successful-people are jealous at you and think you are overrated, trust me, I learnt this on my own skin.

 

[Lindon]

Lol, I think it is not interesting for fandom to attack as much as Sweden. is the most successful country in the recent years, and whole decade overall, but that is why it is also the most hated country, sadly though. But those two things go always together in real life even- being successful-people are jealous at you and think you are overrated, trust me, I learnt this on my own skin.

As the German tv host Robert Lembke once said: "Compassion comes as a gift, but envy must be deserved. "

 

[Pawhlen]

Lol, I think it is not interesting for fandom to attack as much as Sweden. is the most successful country in the recent years, and whole decade overall, but that is why it is also the most hated country, sadly though. But those two things go always together in real life even- being successful-people are jealous at you and think you are overrated, trust me, I learnt this on my own skin.

Spot on

 

[LalehForWD]

[MENTION=15870]Realest[/MENTION] Malta yes! However, this MYESC youtuber must got it completely wrong with 2018 Sweden. Austria and Australia, right? Or did he forget them? They are listed in his previous list "Eurovision 2010-2018 - TOP26 Televoting Qualifiers killed by the Juries!", but not in the actual presentation. Gosh what a horrible collection BTW! Comparing the two can convince anyone on the blessing of the ESC jury.

 

[Pawhlen]

By the way, Christer was guest in "Schlagerprofilerna" last podcast for this ESC-season released today and there he got a question regarding the reactions when he has done the running order all this years (2013, 2016-2018)

And all this angry emotions that comes after revealing the running order is only from the fanbase, none of the delegations are complaining at all (which they have right to do if they really want)

Which means that the producer setting the running order in the final will not go away in the nearest time, because EBU listens more to the actual delegations than they do to the fans (which I think it´s good for the most time, not perfect but still it´s good)