GERMANY 2013 - Cascada - Glorious

[Kicker]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Their ONLY actual international hit was "Everytime We Touch" and that's a fact

Lol? No, that's totally wrong. Their most sucessful song was Evacuate the Dancefloor - selling 3.000.000 copies world wide, entering the top25 of the american charts, peaking at No. 1 in the UK and the Netherlands, as well as in over 10 other countries reaching the top10. Of course, that IS a hit.
Evacuate the Dancefloor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[CC92]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Their ONLY actual international hit was "Everytime We Touch" and that's a fact

To be fair Evacuate the dance floor was a big hit abroad. The rest though did not have much impact on the charts.

 

[Kicker]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Also "Miracle" (#1 in France), "Truly Madly Deeply", "What Hurts The Most" and "Summer Of Love" did very well abroad ^^

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Lol? No, that's totally wrong. Their most sucessful song was Evacuate the Dancefloor - selling 3.000.000 copies world wide, entering the top25 of the american charts, peaking at No. 1 in the UK and the Netherlands, as well as in over 10 other countries reaching the top10. Of course, that IS a hit.
Evacuate the Dancefloor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Well, the one song that comes to my mind when hearing about Cascada is the "Everytime We Touch" cover (it was #1 here, Evacuate top. 15).

But ok then, they had TWO international hits, one cover and one Gaga/RedOne wannabe song ... doesn't change much imo.

 

[Kicker]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Cascada - Vikip
Just look at this - Cascada is still very known in Europe and so they could do quite well - but that's just my personal opinion and I'd say we just let it be this way

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Cascada - Vikip
Just look at this - Cascada is still very known in Europe and so they could do quite well - but that's just my personal opinion and I'd say we just let it be this way

I'd say this is the same case as with Kate Ryan. She's probably equally known, she made her career on making Eurodance covers of known songs... but all in all no one really cares.

 

[Venage]

Re: GERMANY 2013

So you mean younger audience is more important than older?

Here I thought ESC was for everyone, but I must have mistaken then...

Also, the aim of ESC is to represent your country. Maybe in a local sense attracting the younger audience to make it more popular could make sense (although I think that's a narrow-minded way of approaching things), but if you look at the bigger picture I could see someone like her doing pretty well on ESC and also it does represent a part of German local music scene which I think you shouldn't be ashamed of at all.

Sad but true, the young audience is indeed more important than the old ones to the TV stations. Their success is measured in terms of people around the age 14-49. People with the age of 50 and above don't pay off as the TV stations get NOTHING out of advertising for this age-group. It might not be fair, but that's the way it is. As the ARD yearns for a younger image, they won't let a genre participate in the national final which scares off the young audience.

Representing a country doesn't mean that we have to send a Schlager star. There are a lot of good musicians (even successful ones) who sing in German and make pretty good music. Kraftklub for example make good German music and are well received by the younger audience, let alone Casper, Cro, Peter Fox just to name some famous musicians.
In contrast in 2009 only 7% of the people between the age of 20 and 29 were interested in Schlager (source: • Volksmusik und Schlager: Altersstruktur der Käufer 2011 | Statistik).

Funny thing is that these radio programmers and person responsibles (Raab, Schreiber, etc.) are all 40+ and 50+ themselves. Apparently they know best what's good for the youth though. Maybe it is midlife-crisis related or smth.

Of course these people are around the age of 50 or do you suggest putting a 20 year old in the top management of a German TV station? It should be clear that these guys have enough young people who work for them and who are aware of the new trends. Look at the team of 1Live:

Team - 1LIVE

I don't see anyone who looks 40+, so they will most likely know what the majority of young Germans wants. It might not be the music you like to listen to, but they must do something right as they are one of the most successful radio stations for the young audience. I doubt that this would be the case if they started playing Helene Fischer and other Schlager stars ...

 

[Staewi]

Re: GERMANY 2013

I don't see anyone who looks 40+, so they will most likely know what the majority of young Germans wants. It might not be the music you like to listen to, but they must do something right as they are one of the most successful radio stations for the young audience. I doubt that this would be the case if they started playing Helene Fischer and other Schlager stars ...

They don't know what's right for the youth, they get money from America so they hold back our own cultural influences

 

[CC92]

Re: GERMANY 2013

They don't know what's right for the youth, they get money from America so they hold back our own cultural influences

Du schon wieder.

 

[Venage]

Re: GERMANY 2013

They don't know what's right for the youth, they get money from America so they hold back our own cultural influences

And you do?

 

[DanielLuis]

Re: GERMANY 2013

To be honest I wouldnt mind something like Evacuate the dancefloor on eurovisio, except that rap part.

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Sad but true, the young audience is indeed more important than the old ones to the TV stations. Their success is measured in terms of people around the age 14-49. People with the age of 50 and above don't pay off as the TV stations get NOTHING out of advertising for this age-group. It might not be fair, but that's the way it is. As the ARD yearns for a younger image, they won't let a genre participate in the national final which scares off the young audience.

What are you on about? The majority of advertisements are ACTUALLY meant for people 30+ because there's the actual purchasing-power (and not amongst 14-25). Also, 14-49 is a very wide range you mentioned there, hardly just the 'youth'. Well, if they REALLY want a wide range of audience and a general larger one they would let in different genres, a broadcaster limiting themselves would get less audience so you're actually wrong there, they won't get more public by banning a certain genre or only limiting themselves to cater to one audience group, if they manage to have a wide range of styles they would get the largest public possible (like MF).

Representing a country doesn't mean that we have to send a Schlager star. There are a lot of good musicians (even successful ones) who sing in German and make pretty good music. Kraftklub for example make good German music and are well received by the younger audience, let alone Casper, Cro, Peter Fox just to name some famous musicians.
In contrast in 2009 only 7% of the people between the age of 20 and 29 were interested in Schlager (source: • Volksmusik und Schlager: Altersstruktur der Käufer 2011 | Statistik).

I'm just saying what I would like for Germany, surely there are other options. I don't want just 'any' Schlager star, I want Helene because she's got the whole package imo

Well, they are taught into disliking it and there's alot of stigma, but still though this is not just for the youth, it's a song that should be sent for Europe to judge and should represent the German music scene. So far we got very LITTLE of that from Germany and I don't see the harm in atleast trying it? (and with very LITTLE I mean even something representing the more 'contemporary youth' scene, Germany in ESC is probably one of the least genuine and true countries.)

I don't see anyone who looks 40+, so they will most likely know what the majority of young Germans wants. It might not be the music you like to listen to, but they must do something right as they are one of the most successful radio stations for the young audience. I doubt that this would be the case if they started playing Helene Fischer and other Schlager stars ...

Wrong, these so called 'trends' are controlled by the big music labels and more directly by the US market. We are simply being taught into liking something which makes people blind to other options. It's not 'us' as a public that truly decides the trends, we just go along with it and pick the parts we like.

Now, I'm a person who likes different type of music, Schlager is not really a genre I like much, but I do not see the harm in trying something different and new and also one has to not forget that ESC is not really the same forum as some youth pop radio, it has a much wider audience and a whole different purpose than just following trends set by American controlled music executives. This is also meant to reflect the German music scene and German music traditions, something that Germany hasn't really been good at in general (no matter genre or style).

 

[Matt]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Given her popularity I am pretty sure she would have the first place in the televote in her pocket even if her song was not the best/most appealing. Unless she were to compete against acts like Grönemeyer, Peter Fox, Unheilig, Rammstein, maybe Cro etc. but none of the them is going to happen. So well
I find it contradictory and irritating to lable the currently most successful/popular genre 'dated'. If the music meets one's personal taste or not is a different thing.
However, I strongly agree with you that a NF should contain a multitude of various musical genres and styles.

Please advise how Volksmusik/Schlager is the most populare genre currently? Financially? Id like to see those numbers. If you check the German charts you barely see that genre there.

The reason why a lot of people call her music dated is because that exact music is a copycat of songs from the 80s (and earlier) so it's nothing new or groundbreaking.

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Please advise how Volksmusik/Schlager is the most populare genre currently? Financially? Id like to see those numbers. If you check the German charts you barely see that genre there.

The reason why a lot of people call her music dated is because that exact music is a copycat of songs from the 80s (and earlier) so it's nothing new or groundbreaking.

Check the album charts! You know the parts of the charts were the actual $$$ is.

Helene is one of the single best selling acts in German music. She's very consistent in selling plenty enough of albums and selling out Arena tours in ways those "younger youth acts" picked by some talent(less) shows could only dare to dream about.

Also, she's not even an "oldies" act to begin with! Out of all German acts I know about, she's probably one of the few that is actually an all-around-talent that could fit perfectly into the ESC format. It doesn't hurt either that she has a career in all the German speaking countries, the Benelux countries and Denmark aswell. Her Russian background and that she can speak Russian and therefor promote the German entry to the 'ex-USSR' bloc (something that CLEARLY helped Rybak back in 2009!), could also prove to be helpful in the context of ESC.

Also, she's doing a very 'German' type of music, and with all these American/wannabe entries previously maybe it's time for something different? Eventhough her style may be seen 'dated and old' in Germany, for ESC it would be something fresh and new to see Germany going for something like this.

She could enter a ballad in German for instance (doesn't have to be umpha-umpha Schlager):

^ The German language (just as Swedish) fits very well in ballad-form.

 

[Matt]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Check the album charts! You know the parts of the charts were the actual $$$ is.

Helene is one of the single best selling acts in German music. She's very consistent in selling plenty enough of albums and selling out Arena tours in ways those "younger youth acts" picked by some talent(less) show would only dare to dream about.

Also, she's not even an "oldies" act to begin with! Out of all German acts I know about, she's probably one of the few that is actually an all-around-talent that could fit perfectly into ESC. It doesn't hurt either that she has a career in all the German speaking countries, the Benelux countries and Denmark aswell. Her Russian background and that she can speak Russian and therefor promote the German entry to the 'ex-USSR' bloc (something that CLEARLY helped Rybak back in 2009!), could also prove to be helpful in the context of ESC.

Also, she's doing a very 'German' type of music, and with all these American entries maybe it's time for something different? Eventhough her style may be seen 'dated and old' in Germany, for ESC it would be something fresh and new to see Germany going for something like this.

You are talking about 1 act, I'm talking as the genre as a whole. How many other Schlager acts can you find there? the point is because one singer out of the Schlager/Volksmusik genre is doing well doesn't really mean the entire music style is just as popular.

It's okay if you like or dislike her, I just really believe it would be a terrible choice.

 

[Staewi]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Check the album charts! You know the parts of the charts were the actual $$$ is.

Helene is one of the single best selling acts in German music. She's very consistent in selling plenty enough of albums and selling out Arena tours in ways those "younger youth acts" picked by some talent(less) show would only dare to dream about.

Also, she's not even an "oldies" act to begin with! Out of all German acts I know about, she's probably one of the few that is actually an all-around-talent that could fit perfectly into ESC.

No one says that Helene Fischer is talentfree or unsuccessful in Germany, but she definetly is NOT in the youth, I'm still a student and so I come across a lot of music trends and tastes, but no one (apart from CC92) I know likes her or listens to her. The reasons for this don't matter for this, this is a fact. And this is the problem of choosing her: Today, ESC is about commerciality and in times of the jury a chart placing is far more important than a point in the ESC final. But only limited numbers of the younger would buy a copy and "older" people maybe don't know where to grab copies or aren't interested because this is a new phenomenon they don't know, hence her ESC-participation wouldn't be a success.

 

[Matt]

Re: GERMANY 2013

And I should clarify that is nothing against Helene. I'm purely referring to her traditional music style. With the right song it could totallywork. e.g. michelle (2001) was a Schlager singer and I actually enjoyed her entry as well. And helene did some really awesome covers (you raise me up) so there is potential.

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

You are talking about 1 act, I'm talking as the genre as a whole. How many other Schlager acts can you find there? the point is because one singer out of the Schlager/Volksmusik genre is doing well doesn't really mean the entire music style is just as popular.

It's okay if you like or dislike her, I just really believe it would be a terrible choice.

No one says that Helene Fischer is talentfree or unsuccessful in Germany, but she definetly is NOT in the youth, I'm still a student and so I come across a lot of music trends and tastes, but no one (apart from CC92) I know likes her or listens to her. The reasons for this don't matter for this, this is a fact. And this is the problem of choosing her: Today, ESC is about commerciality and in times of the jury a chart placing is far more important than a point in the ESC final. But only limited numbers of the younger would buy a copy and "older" people maybe don't know where to grab copies or aren't interested because this is a new phenomenon they don't know, hence her ESC-participation wouldn't be a success.

Well, I'm mostly talking about her because she's my #1 pick for Germany

There are some other Schlager acts that sells very well though (like Andrea Berg for instance), but it's not really what I want... I'm simply talking about Helene

Why is it terrible to try something else than acting American copycats every year and choosing acts from talent-shows "Idol-style"? I think Europe would appreciate a more genuine approach from Germany for a change, and Europe will be the judge here not some youth-obsessed local radio programmers. ESC is not just for pop and teenagers, and looking at the top. 10 of 2012 it's getting quite hard to argue that 'only contemporary pop works' because not much of the top. 10 could be labeled as such, quite the contrary! Tbh, I think the dislike here has more to do with German stigma of this genre than a rational analysis of ESC.

It's odd to see people going on in other threads about how countries should send local-sounding entries and entries in their own languages, but then have this dislike for doing the same from their own country. I thought ESC was to embrace Europe and all there is to it and not just follow some trends?

 

[A-lister]

Re: GERMANY 2013

And I should clarify that is nothing against Helene. I'm purely referring to her traditional music style. With the right song it could totallywork. e.g. michelle (2001) was a Schlager singer and I actually enjoyed her entry as well. And helene did some really awesome covers (you raise me up) so there is potential.

Michelle couldn't sing to save her life though

I think a ballad by Helene could work out really well (like the one I posted above). As for the uptempo it's more hit-or-miss, but something like 'Ich will immer wieder dieser...' it could go down well with the European public because it's catchy, schlager but in a more 'modern' way (and with modern I mean more in a timeless way with a bit of pop into it, sorta like the Swedish schlagers at times).

 

[Venage]

Re: GERMANY 2013

Well, I'm mostly talking about her because she's my #1 pick for Germany

There are some other Schlager acts that sells very well though (like Andrea Berg for instance), but it's not really what I want... I'm simply talking about Helene

Why is it terrible to try something else than acting American copycats every year and choosing acts from talent-shows "Idol-style"? I think Europe would appreciate a more genuine approach from Germany for a change, and Europe will be the judge here not some youth-obsessed local radio programmers. ESC is not just for pop and teenagers, and looking at the top. 10 of 2012 it's getting quite hard to argue that 'only contemporary pop works' because not much of the top. 10 could be labeled as such, quite the contrary! Tbh, I think the dislike here has more to do with German stigma of this genre than a rational analysis of ESC.

It's odd to see people going on in other threads about how countries should send local-sounding entries and entries in their own languages, but then have this dislike for doing the same from their own country. I thought ESC was to embrace Europe and all there is to it and not just follow some trends?

Sending local-sounding entries doesn't mean sending Schlager. There are enough modern German groups which I would gladly send to Eurovision