Do you like the new voting system?

[Stargazer]

Historically countries have been able to change things in the presentation and broadcast of the show. For example, the Dutch were the first to introduce postcards between the songs in 1970 (they had to do something to pad it out after everyone pulled out). The UK were going to have postcards, actually in 1963, but for some reason the videos of children's tv characters Pinky and Perky were never used.

Anyway, the point is, while the host country can innovate in terms of the broadcast, they don't get to meddle with the rules of the competition. SVT are special though.

How do you know no other host gets to change the rules? How do you know the rule changes come strictly from SVT and not from EBU themselves? Do you work at EBU? I doubt EBU lets SVT do whatever the hell they want. I'm sure SVT needs to submit their proposals for approval like everyone else, and I'm sure EBU would turn them down if they didn't like them. It's not like SVT would pull out if they didn't get the changes they wanted, we love this contest too much in this country for that.

 

[DanielLuis]

SVT probably proposed the idea to the EBU, but the EBU and the reference group were the ones that accepted it and that enforced the new rule. Plus, they said they had been studying this idea since 2012.

 

[Mickey]

How do you know no other host gets to change the rules? How do you know the rule changes come strictly from SVT and not from EBU themselves? Do you work at EBU? I doubt EBU lets SVT do whatever the hell they want. I'm sure SVT needs to submit their proposals for approval like everyone else, and I'm sure EBU would turn them down if they didn't like them. It's not like SVT would pull out if they didn't get the changes they wanted, we love this contest too much in this country for that.

You're right, if you asked EBU who decided on the changes, they'd say "decisions are made by the EBU reference group..." but then they announce the changes with a video of Christer Bjorkman and Martin Osterdahl telling us how great their idea is and how they've been trialling it for years in Melodifestivalen.

I was probably a little harsh at the end there. My feeling is that getting changes through at Eurovision is a similar process as making changes at any institution. You need a workable idea first, but then you need the connections and friends in high places to get it through. SVT certainly have the latter, but they're probably also the ones who care the most about making changes at Eurovision.

SVT certainly don't get granted special powers just by virtue of winning the contest, though.

 

[Mii11]

But Turkey wasn't hosting when they requested the change, were they? I'm sure if Turkey won and hosted, they could change some things too. EBU doesn't need to consult us about anything, we don't own Eurovision.

Obviously we do not own Eurovision: we are part of Eurovision, without us it wouldn't exist because it would not be as successful. If people did not watch it, Eurovision would end up like Dance Eurovision. We are not here for EBU: EBU is here for us. Being a host doesn't matter because every member of EBU should be equal and the changes impact all the countries in the EBU not only the host. However, Sweden is clearly favored by the EBU so SVT is allowed to do as they wish.

If every hosting country is allowed to change rules according to their own wishes, then I hope Portugal will win next year so that they can introduce language rule and make the contest more like Festival da Cancao. That would be exciting

 

[Stargazer]

Obviously we do not own Eurovision: we are part of Eurovision, without us it wouldn't exist because it would not be as successful. If people did not watch it, Eurovision would end up like Dance Eurovision. We are not here for EBU: EBU is here for us. Being a host doesn't matter because every member of EBU should be equal and the changes impact all the countries in the EBU not only the host. However, Sweden is clearly favored by the EBU so SVT is allowed to do as they wish.

If every hosting country is allowed to change rules according to their own wishes, then I hope Portugal will win next year so that they can introduce language rule and make the contest more like Festival da Cancao. That would be exciting

If you ask me, the Eurovision audience has become greedy and fickle. Back in the day, when I first started watching Eurovision, the TV audience had no power and no say in the voting whatsoever. It was all jury voting. But guess what, we watched it and we enjoyed it anyway. Now that the audience has influence in the voting, people are still not happy about it and want even more influence and power, and would probably stop watching the contest altogether if it went back to 100% jury voting (not me, though). A sad testament to the me-me-me-generation.

But honestly, I would welcome more changes to the rules from each host country as it would make each edition feel different and not so cookie-cutter. And yes please to the return of the language rule!

 

[A-lister]

I've come to the conclusion that the change is good afterall !

I might have done it slightly differently myself, but having giving it more proper thought I think it'll be good...

Now they NEED to allow entries to have more people on stage though, the limit of six people is ridiculous in this time era, especially for more demanding stage shows... of course having more people shouldn't be compulsorary, but the option should be there... I think 8-10 people could be a good change.

Other than that I wouldn't really do any major changes, I wouldn't like the idea of allowing some pre-recorded back-vocals as they have in MF for instance (sure it sounds better and are helpful in some cases, but I think it all has to stay live regardless of the benefits because no one should be able to hide behind this).

 

[NeonProject]

I'm really bored of people whining about SVT constantly. Change needs to happen for a show to stay relevant and whilst people are saying it wasn't broke... well, the voting has got a bit boring and why not try new things? If we always waited until we NEEDED these changes, we'd end up constantly going back to the issues of the 2000's, which I personally would prefer to avoid.
A lot of whiners had already decided they would hate everything SVT do as soon as they won and it seems to be a bandwagon thing now moaning about SVT. I'm all for expressing opinions, but this particular fad has jumped the shark now. You people are just coming across as constantly negative and you're becoming a huge running joke amongst the ESC community and I guarantee come May you will be the butt of the hosts' jokes too.

As for SVT's "special treatment", every broadcaster can propose these changes, most just choose not to. I imagine they fear changing things and having such (over the top) reactions to changes. Luckily, SVT will not be dictated or pressured by the fans, they are dedicated to creating a good TV show and they see changes as a necessary thing. SVT doesn't get special treatment, they just dare to challenge the whiny bitches in our fandom.

Give things a chance, if it doesn't work, then you can start freaking out. And stop moaning about things before they've even been announced... the fact that there is a thread titled "How will Christer Björkman ruin this years show" is an absolute farce.

 

[12Points]

I’m only feeling sorry for our poor Indonesian [MENTION=12901]12Points[/MENTION], he won’t be worth as much anymore ):

1

 

[dcs34]

An important thing with this change that I think has been overlooked is that the juries will no longer be able to automatically sink the public's favourite entry (i.e. voting Poland 26th in 2014 so no matter how many votes it got it wasn't going to receive points). As the jury votes and public votes are being split and delivered as separate 1-12 points (i.e. up to 24 points available from each country).

 

[macmillanandwife]

Well this isn't the first time the EBU changed its voting system. It was when Sweden hosted the contest in 1975 is when they introduce the douze point system. So it is not the first time that such a change has happened. I am currently unsure on the new presentation of the votes, the separation of televote and jury vote is a welcomed change. It defeats the chances of voting nullification, and definitely reduces the changes of getting "nul point" significantly. However, I would change a few things.

1) Compound the jury votes instead of the televote.
2) Announce the compounded jury score at the beginning of the voting process and announce these scores by the hosts by running order instead form lowest to highest.
3) Let the announcers announce the televote instead of the jury vote. It gives greater focus on the people's voice instead of the juries as it is literally Europe's voice.
4) If a country cannot provide a valid televote or if the jury vote is nullified (which where there is still a possibility) either give everyone 12 points or select the countries giving votes at complete random by computer by PricewaterhouseCoopers. That way there is no sense of corruption, as I feel those "selected countries" will include Sweden getting top votes.

With these changes, I think it would make the voting more exciting.

 

[Blu]

SVT doesn't always get it their own way, amongst other things they were very sceptical about the inclusion of Australia in 2015.

 

[SwedishFailurez]

I have calculated how the results of previous years with the 2013-2015 voting system would ended up with the new voting system. Im excluding 2013 because the tele/juryvote split are only known by average places, not by points.

[B][U]2015[/U][/B]

Sweden [B]642 1st[/B] (-0) 
Italy [B]550 2nd[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR] 
Russia [B]533 3rd [/B][COLOR="#FF0000"](-1) [/COLOR]


Belguim [B]382 4th[/B] (-0) 
Australia [B]356 5th[/B] (-0) 
Latvia [B]349 6th[/B] (-0) 
Norway [B]206 7th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR] 
Estonia [B]200 8th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1) [/COLOR]
Israel [B]184 9th[/B] (-0) 
Serbia [B]120 10th[/B] (-0)


Albania [B]119 11th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+6)[/COLOR]
Georgia [B]113 12th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
Azerbaijan [B]96 13th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
Armenia [B]95 14th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+2)[/COLOR]
Romania [B]90 15th[/B] (-0)


Montenegro [B]82 16th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-3)[/COLOR]
Slovenia [B]75 17th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-3)[/COLOR]
Lithuania [B]75 18th[/B] (-0)
Cyprus [B]71 19th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+4)[/COLOR]
Greece [B]54 20th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]


Hungary [B]50 21st[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
Poland [B]49 22nd[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR]
Austria [B]40 23rd[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+4)[/COLOR]
Spain [B]34 24th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-3)[/COLOR]
Germany [B]29 25th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+2)[/COLOR]
France [B]28 26th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
UK [B]19 27th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-4)[/COLOR]

[B][U]2014[/U][/B]

Austria [B]535 1st[/B] (-0)
Netherlands [B]422 2nd[/B] (-0)
Sweden [B]391 3rd[/B] (-0)


Armenia [B]318 4th[/B] (-0)
Hungary [B]236 5th[/B] (-0)
Russia [B]202 6th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR]
Poland [B]185 7th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+7)[/COLOR]
Ukraine [B]182 8th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-2)[/COLOR]
Romania [B]154 9th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+3)[/COLOR]
Finland [B]153 10th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR]


Switzerland [B]141 11th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+2)[/COLOR]
Norway [B]141 12th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-4)[/COLOR]
Malta [B]136 13th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+10)[/COLOR]
Azerbaijan [B]134 14th[/B] [COLOR="#008000"](+8)[/COLOR]
Denmark [B]128 15th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-6)[/COLOR]


Spain [B]124 16th[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-6)[/COLOR]
Belarus [B]106 17th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
Iceland [B]105 18th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-2)[/COLOR]
Greece [B]92 19th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR]
Germany [B]92 20th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-2)[/COLOR]


Montenegro [B]82 21st[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-2)[/COLOR]
UK [B]81 22nd[/B] [COLOR="#800000"](-5)[/COLOR]
Italy [B]69 23rd[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-2)[/COLOR]
Slovenia [B]36 24th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"](+1)[/COLOR]
San Marino [B]34 25th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"](-1)[/COLOR]
France [B]6 26th[/B] (-0)

Here are the results who differ the most.
2014 (+10)
2014 (+8)
2014 (+7)
2015 (+6)
2015 (+4)
2015 (+4)
+/-
2015 (-3)
2015 (-3)
2015 (-3)
2015 (-4)
2014 (-4)
2014 (-5)
2014 (-6)
2014 (-6)

 

[Nikkita]

It's really mean to spotlight the jury vote when most of the fans want to see juries' impact reduced. It made me think that Björkman wants to ruin the contest.

 

[Rusch]

I actually like it. The audience will notice jury manipulation and they will act. And giving the televotes seperately will give an extra spin. But the in the end the results would be almost the same with the old system.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

The UK really seems like it's going to be kicked in the head by this new system.. like we aren't doing bad enough

 

[macmillanandwife]

The UK really seems like it's going to be kicked in the head by this new system.. like we aren't doing bad enough

The same can go with Spain. Now with this new system, I wish the EBU would release the split scores from 2013 as I am interested to see if Valentina would have qualified then. I doubt it though.

 

[macmillanandwife]

Since [MENTION=10910]SwedishFailurez[/MENTION] since you posted the Final Results for 2014 & 2015. I'll post the semis for 2014 and 2015...in separate posts.

2014
Semi-Final 1

Netherlands [B]277 1st[/B] 0
Hungary [B]247 2nd[/B] 0
Sweden [B]247 =2nd[/B] 0
Armenia [B]223 4th[/B] 0
Ukraine [B]207 5th[/B] 0
Azerbaijan [B]135 6th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Russia [B]130 7th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Iceland [B]118 8th[/B] 0
Montenegro [B]117 9th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-2[/COLOR]
Portugal [B]89 10th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]

Albania [B]87 11th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+4[/COLOR]
San Marino [B]83 12th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-2[/COLOR]
Estonia [B]74 13th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Latvia [B]67 14th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Belgium [B]65 15th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Moldova [B]38 16th[/B] 0

Qualifiers: Netherlands, Hungary, Sweden, Armenia, Ukraine, Azerbaijan, Russia, Iceland, Montenegro, Portugal (at the expense of San Marino )

Semi-Final 2

Austria [B]303 1st[/B] 0
Romania [B]225 2nd[/B] 0
Finland [B]180 3rd[/B] 0
Belarus [B]157 4th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Norway [B]155 5th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Poland [B]150 6th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+2[/COLOR]
Switzerland [B]149 7th[/B][COLOR="#FF0000"]-3[/COLOR]
Malta [B]149 =7th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+2[/COLOR]
Greece [B]143 9th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-2[/COLOR]
Slovenia [B]108 10th[/B] 0

Macedonia [B]98 11th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+2[/COLOR]
Lithuania [B]85 12th[/B][COLOR="#FF0000"] -1[/COLOR]
Ireland [B]80 13th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Israel [B]58 14th[/B] 0
Georgia [B]48 15th[/B] 0

Qualifiers: Austria, Romania, Finland, Belarus, Norway, Poland, Switzerland, Malta, Greece, Slovenia

 

[macmillanandwife]

2015 Semi-Finals
Semi-Final 1

Russia [B]318 1st[/B] 0
Belgium [B]275 2nd[/B] 0
Estonia [B]202 3rd[/B] 0
Georgia [B]192 4th[/B] 0
Romania [B]163 5th[/B] 0
Greece [B]160 6th[/B] 0
Armenia [B]144 7th[/B] 0
Serbia [B]133 8th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Albania [B]127 9th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Hungary [B]120 10th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-2[/COLOR]

Belarus [B]98 11th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Moldova [B]94 12th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Netherlands [B]93 13th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+1[/COLOR]
Denmark [B]81 14th[/B] [COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Macedonia [B]64 15th[/B] 0
Finland [B]56 16th[/B] 0

Qualifiers: Russia, Belgium, Estonia, Georgia, Romania, Greece, Armenia, Serbia, Albania, Hungary

Semi-Final 2

Sweden [B]403 1st[/B] 0
Israel [B]271 2nd[/B] 0
Latvia [B]271 =2nd[/B] 0
Norway [B]248 4th[/B] 0
Slovenia [B]179 5th[/B] 0
Cyprus [B]156 6th[/B] 0
Lithuania [B]150 7th[/B] 0
Poland [B]124 8th[/B] 0
Malta [B]116 9th[/B] [COLOR="#00FF00"]+2[/COLOR]
Montenegro [B]105 10th[/B][COLOR="#FF0000"] -1[/COLOR]

Azerbaijan [B]104 11th[/B][COLOR="#FF0000"]-1[/COLOR]
Ireland [B]98 12th[/B] 0
Czech Republic [B]85 13th[/B] 0
Portugal [B]47 14th[/B] 0
Iceland [B]36 15th[/B] 0
San Marino [B]22 16th[/B] 0
Switzerland [B]21 17th[/B] 0

Qualifiers: Sweden, Israel, Latvia, Norway, Slovenia, Cyprus, Lithuania, Poland, Malta, Montenegro (at the expense of Azerbaijan)

 

[macmillanandwife]

Actually, now looking at all these results, I have a question.

What happens if there's a tie?

 

[Kaz]

Actually, now looking at all these results, I have a question.

What happens if there's a tie?

Same as previously, I believe; whoever got more 12 points, then 10 points down to 1 point. If it's still a tie then, whoever performed first.