RUSSIA 2010 - The Pyotr Nalich band - Lost And Forgotten

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

^ "Eurovision deja vu" exclusively on RTR .... including Ukrainian singers and Dima Bilan :twisted:
I can already imagine reaction of Russian press if the miracle happens and she will be chosen for the NF
eh, I don't think that it happens though, I'd like to watch Russian unknown performers instead

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Roma Kenga is another quite famous name that applied for the NF with this song (I guess there will be edited version):
[youtube:137204ac]XoLe_65LESk[/youtube:137204ac]
source: mk.ru

Not a single star who's famous in ex-USSR (like Valeriya in NF 2009, for instance).

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Another Ukrainian singer (lol) that didn't pass internal selection will apply for the Russian NF:

Nataliya Valevskaya

the song is a nice substitute for Anna Semenovich (NF 2009), imo

 

[Merg]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

The Russian NF more and more becomes similar to branch of the Ukrainian NF. Natalia Volkova, Natalia Valevskaja, Alexander Panajotov - here far incomplete list of the Ukrainian actors who have declared the decision to take part in the Russian NF.

 

[Merg]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Sergey Lazarev has declared the refusal to participate in selection round this year.

 

[evilperson]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

I liked it better when Russia internally selected their song and singer. It just seems that holding a national final becomes a farce in these countries with different camps accusing each other of buying the win and blah blah blah. Also it was quite clear last years winner was completely set up. It was a last minute addition to the national final just days before the competition was going to take place with the singer having strong ties with the broadcaster. I'm surprised she was able to keep a straight face after everything went down and she was awarded. But anyways, whats there to do. Oh yeah, select internally...

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

I liked it better when Russia internally selected their song and singer. It just seems that holding a national final becomes a farce in these countries with different camps accusing each other of buying the win and blah blah blah. Also it was quite clear last years winner was completely set up. It was a last minute addition to the national final just days before the competition was going to take place with the singer having strong ties with the broadcaster. I'm surprised she was able to keep a straight face after everything went down and she was awarded. But anyways, whats there to do. Oh yeah, select internally...

Well, Jade was also a last minute addition
And it's not a farce only in "these countries", it's a farce around the whole Europe so no need in blaming just certain countries
And tbh out of all Russian finalists in 2009 Pryhod'ko seemed the best choice. Valeriya? with a classic sample prohibitred by ESC rules, it would be withdrawed right after choosing the entry )))
As for choosing internally... well, it's even more set up cuz others have no chances at all
When you select internally it's about the most rich performer or someone who's liked by broadcaster, just what you said about Pryhod'ko As for scandals & farce, there always will be scandals with any system, ignore them if you dislike them

 

[evilperson]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

I liked it better when Russia internally selected their song and singer. It just seems that holding a national final becomes a farce in these countries with different camps accusing each other of buying the win and blah blah blah. Also it was quite clear last years winner was completely set up. It was a last minute addition to the national final just days before the competition was going to take place with the singer having strong ties with the broadcaster. I'm surprised she was able to keep a straight face after everything went down and she was awarded. But anyways, whats there to do. Oh yeah, select internally...

Well, Jade was also a last minute addition
And it's not a farce only in "these countries", it's a farce around the whole Europe so no need in blaming just certain countries
And tbh out of all Russian finalists in 2009 Pryhod'ko seemed the best choice. Valeriya? with a classic sample prohibitred by ESC rules, it would be withdrawed right after choosing the entry )))
As for choosing internally... well, it's even more set up cuz others have no chances at all
When you select internally it's about the most rich performer or someone who's liked by broadcaster, just what you said about Pryhod'ko As for scandals & farce, there always will be scandals with any system, ignore them if you dislike them

Oh I'm pretty sure I've heard of Jade though I think she was only a last minute audition that ended up making the cut after all was said and done.
Do other performers really have chances in the national final format? The Russian final in 2009 was basically a huge insult to the viewers intelligence. The broadcaster clearly wanted Anastasiya to win, they should've just canceled the NF and sent her when she came crying on their doorstep after that whole Ukrainian rejection drama where she threatened to sue every last Ukrainian who dared cross her gaze.
I agree, a lot of finals across Europe have their scandals, though I think ignoring them is a problem.

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Oh I'm pretty sure I've heard of Jade though I think she was only a last minute audition that ended up making the cut after all was said and done.
Do other performers really have chances in the national final format? The Russian final in 2009 was basically a huge insult to the viewers intelligence. The broadcaster clearly wanted Anastasiya to win, they should've just canceled the NF and sent her when she came crying on their doorstep after that whole Ukrainian rejection drama where she threatened to sue every last Ukrainian who dared cross her gaze.
I agree, a lot of finals across Europe have their scandals, though I think ignoring them is a problem.

Jade was invited in the last minute just like Pryhod'ko, except there were no NF rounds in Russia. Well, she won Russian Star Factory which is ORT's product, no wonder so many people voted for her and no wonder that ORT liked her. They would have chosen her in any case.
Lmao, huge insult to the vieweres because... :?:
The viewers were allowed to vote and it was obvious televoter's choice as well (she overpassed Valeriya by miles) *shrugs*
lol, I agree that it was a huge drama ... maybe it influenced televoters as well, dunno.
Let's be honest... it was very weak NF then ))) I'm wondering about this one.... but I don't have high hopes, considering people who have already applied and there are no famous names at all ... I hope for wildcards.
ps. Ignoring scandals is a problem? ))) if these scandals are aimed at broadcasters then they make no sense because broadcasters participate in ESC and they have a right to choose entries using ANY way... so complaining makes no sense, they get the biggest ESC income from sponsors, not from televoters so they don't care. Scandals over performers - if only they abolish rules. Other than that it's just a nice entertainment... imho, they just hurt national selections.

 

[A-lister]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

I liked it better when Russia internally selected their song and singer. It just seems that holding a national final becomes a farce in these countries with different camps accusing each other of buying the win and blah blah blah. Also it was quite clear last years winner was completely set up. It was a last minute addition to the national final just days before the competition was going to take place with the singer having strong ties with the broadcaster. I'm surprised she was able to keep a straight face after everything went down and she was awarded. But anyways, whats there to do. Oh yeah, select internally...

Alot of selections are corrupt, not only in Russia... and it's not like choosing internally is more "democratic". But I can sort of get your point... but still, who do you think should win in the '09 selection then? Anastasia's song basically saved that selection and was by far the best out of them all.

 

[Andalublue]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Much as I enjoy all the NF voting, ESC rules do not state that selection has to be scrupulously democratic. If a broadcaster wants to choose internally and not submit to a public vote, then they can. What is bad is if they pretend to hold a democratic process and then corruptly manipulate it to get the result they want while still pretending its the result the people want. Does that ring any bells? Mahmoud? Vladimir? Viktor?

 

[Matt]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Much as I enjoy all the NF voting, ESC rules do not state that selection has to be scrupulously democratic. If a broadcaster wants to choose internally and not submit to a public vote, then they can. What is bad is if they pretend to hold a democratic process and then corruptly manipulate it to get the result they want while still pretending its the result the people want. Does that ring any bells? Mahmoud? Vladimir? Viktor?

Word.

I mentioned something similar in the Azerbaijan thread. It's okay if the broadcaster wants to pick their entry internally but using a NF just so they can call it "democratic voting" is just wrong. And as Aleks said before, Russia is not the only country doing that.

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

We don't have facts about corrupted selections in Russia, just complaining of losers and a lil' bit of xenophobic prejudices... get some proofs, not speculations.
Speaking of 2010 NF
I hope that Alexander Panaiotov participates, he's said earlier that it's possible. I want him finally 2go2 ESC

 

[evilperson]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

There are no prejudices here, last years selection was definitely set up for Anastasiya to win, as soon as I heard that she was accepted into the selection it was a done deal. I don't really understand why you tried to counter what I was saying with Jade and the United Kingdom selection. I read up on it and it was simply not the same case. Jade was an unknown singer who was presented by a casting company, very last minute during the audition period and she ended up being selected on merit by Andrew Lloyd Webber and his team to be part of the 6 finalists. Its not like the BBC announced 5 performers and then decided one day before the start of the selection to inject an additional performer that they clearly and without a doubt preferred.

The Russian broadcaster finalized a list of 15 performers for the national final at the end of February last year. Literally, a day or two before the final was to occur, "Mamo" was added into the mix; a song that didnt even apply to the selection initially with all of the other candidates. Now if you really want to believe that Anastasiya was chosen on merit that's fine, but I simply do not believe that considering how obvious it was that it was rigged to me. You said yourself that Anastasiya was a reality show winner with the same broadcaster and she clearly had strong ties for them to suddenly allow her to come into the final just before it was about to start. Why hold a national final if at the end of the day the broadcaster is just going to torpedo the whole thing to make sure that the song they want will win? They could have canceled the national final and announced this as the entry instead or they could have just allowed a jury to vote because I really don't believe for one second that she won the public televote. That is my point of view on the situation, you clearly see things differently but its nobodies duty to prove each another wrong. After reading this hopefully you'll understand my perspective better.

As for scandals, they do happen in both Western and Eastern countries, I didn't mean to imply that it was just Russia. What I meant was countries who continually have difficulties with scandals and arguments should just select internally. Though even that doesn't seem to be a resolution if we look at Ukraine this year. Some people are just very hard to please.

In the Russian selection for 2009, I thought the best choices were Aleksey Vorobyov and Polina Griffith.

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

^ and I don't really understand why you say that it was set up without any single proof.
yep, they did inject one performer (Jade) before the start of the real selection with televoters. Except there were more rounds. The point is: broadcasters (ie. selection juries) can do ANYTHING they like.

Pryhod'ko was introduced as a wildcard, her producer negotiated with the channel at least 1 week before the show, right around the time of the deadline. Decision went public 2 days before the final because of the court's decision in Ukraine which was coming too late that's why they decided do not continue the case. When it was clear that Ukrainian court won't add her to Ukrainian final ORT made the public announcement.
btw, her producer is also really famous (he produced VIA GRA band and he composes songs for the top Russian stars) so it also adds some popularity for televoters.
As for general line-up... strong performers were afraid of registering because it was clear even before the NF that Russia won't win (meaning a flop for established performer)... even the head of ORT said that. So there were tons of B-list celebrities excluding Pryhod'ko and Valeriya. Imo, Valeriya wasn't chosen by the jury because Russia would be disqualified by EBU because of her song if she won (1 week before EBU deadline and she had no new song).

If you talk about ties with ORT ... ALL performers in the final had ties with ORT ))) some of them participated in the previous selections. Some of them (like Valeriya) had rich producer and participated in ORT's concerts and projects. Saying that only Pryhod'ko was obvious broadcaster's fave would be unfair.
Asking "why did they hold the NF?" is weird because people also voted among with the jury... though televoters chose top-3 and the jury chose the winner out of televoter's top-3. Pryhod'ko had only 1 more jury's vote than Valeriya. People chose only top-3 performers for the jury.

Every country has scandals, thanks to all dissatisfied performers, producers, yellow press etc. It's a powerful promotional tool. Yep, it's dirty and unnecessary at some point... also performers who start scandals usually hurt their own image. There are A LOT of lies of course. A LOT of real things are hidden etc. It distracts from the ESC entry blah blah blah.
well, 2010 scandals in Ukraine are almost over. After that Vasyl' got enormous promo all over the country , people who were against him got promotion before Russian selection in order to impress the jury and got support from Ukrainian viewers if they win in Russia. Everybody's happy, lol. Our performers "immigrate" to Russia where RTR would sponsor their ESC entry if they win ))). Vasyl' sponsors his own participation himself so ordinary Ukrainians win too and he receives big popularity here I think only people who disagree with internal choice are unhappy, but this is their own problem. All their faves can't go to ESC at once
lol, I imagine what would happen if Russia also chose internally this year. Belarusian, Ukrainian and Russian performers would have "attacked" other countries :shock:

btw. RTR also stated that they can add a wildcard(s) so I don't exclude 2009 situation.

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

Max Satsura (NF 2008) applied as well.


and the MOST controversial performer of NF 2010:

The most famous p**n star of ex-USSR Elena Berkova (she's from my city, btw )!
With the song «The bear arrived»

 

[94ayd]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

LOL! Another Ukrainian?!

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

^ wow, being Ukrainian is more confusing than being a p**n star ))) cool!

Just like Pryhod'ko she participated in reality show. When they found out about her p**n career she was eliminated. After that she became a TV host, she recorded an album and left p**n business )))
She lives in St. Petersburg and Moscow but she visits my city sometimes.

 

[94ayd]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

She's an ex-one as you can see. I don't find it that bad... The Ukrainian thing is because over the last 2 years there's been probably more Ukrainians than Russians in the Russian selection. I mean, you've already announced some, taking part in this year's one.

 

[AlekS]

Re: POCC?? - Russia 2010

I know There are few Belorussians and Russians too
imo, Valevskaya and Volkova have chances. I doubt that RTR agrees to have Berkova, no matter what song she chooses
I predict Roma Kenga, Max Satsura, Balagan Limited, Nataliya Volkova, Nataliya Valevskaya for the final.