Jury Criteria

[bstream]

For those more adept in the behind-the-scenes stuff at ESC, do you know what kind of criteria the juries seem to be going for?

Is it well produced stage shows? Is it radio-friendly tracks? Is it classy ballads? I thought I understood the formula until Sweden won the juries and Italy won the televote in 2015, not the other way around.

 

[mauve]

Would love to know about this question too as the night yesterday left me really irritated.

 

[WhoKnows]

Don't ask how I got this.

Sweden or Australia? Add 20 positions to the ranking?
Western country that's not one of the above? Add 10 positions to ranking.
Western country using a prop? Subtract 5 ranking positions.
Eastern country? Subtract 10 positions.
Eastern country using a prop? Subtract 20 positions.

 

[midnightsun]

from the official eurovision.net website:

Each national jury is made up of five music industry professionals who will evaluate each entry. The jury members are asked to judge the vocal capacity of the singer, the performance on stage, the composition and originality of the song and the overall impression of the act. Jurors rank all entries, except their own country's contribution.

To keep things fair, the work of the juries is supervised by a notary in each country, and the EBU's independent observers of EY reserve the right to pay surprise visits to the jury panel in order to ensure that the voting is being conducted in accordance with the Rules of the Eurovision Song Contest. After the submission of their vote, the EBU works together with EY to check and verify the jury results. In case of apparent irregularities, a national jury vote may be discarded.

Becoming a juror
There are strict admission rules for becoming a member of the jury.
Members of the jury must not have been part of the jury in the previous two years;
Members of the jury must be at least 16 years old on the day they vote;
Members of the jury must not be employees of Participating Broadcasters;
Members of the jury must pursue a profession in or related to the music industry;
Members of the jury shall be citizens of the country they represent;
No member of a jury shall be connected in any way with any of the participating songs entered and/or artists performing in the contest in such a way that they cannot vote in complete independence and impartiality.
Juries are selected by the Participating Broadcaster that represents each country.

 

[midnightsun]

I think we all agree that some do not necessarily stick to the rules.

So I have to say, let the juries go.

 

[lolita]

Modern, quality produced song and good stage performace, for sure. They don't look necessary for smart, pretentious lyrics, and strong vocals, more for radio-friendly, but excellent produced songs. They don't like dated songs. All examples of this could be seen in previous few years. Sometimes they go for the emotion like in Salvador's and Jamala's song.

 

[esc87fan]

When voting, the juries are asked to focus on these four areas:

1. Vocal capacity of the artist(s)
2. The performance on stage
3. The composition and originality of the song
4. The overall impression of the act

There is nothing in the criteria about radio friendliness

 

[lolita]

When voting, the juries are asked to focus on these four areas:

1. Vocal capacity of the artist(s)
2. The performance on stage
3. The composition and originality of the song
4. The overall impression of the act

There is nothing in the criteria about radio friendliness

Well, they are open-minded people, they have right to like what they like, not to vote for what you and I like. That is all, I don't understand the fuss. Being radio-friendly is not bad criteria like people often portray it here. I've just made conclusion from the results of the past years, it is easy to see.

 

[Neo]

How do we know this?

Is this from the rumored 'green paper' I've heard juries get from ESC beforehand?

Still wrong to have singing prowess be weighted when it's a SONG contest.

 

[midnightsun]

...they have right to like what they like, not to vote for what you and I like.

Imo exactly this is what juries were NOT created for! Because that means all Jurors vote for their neighbour countries whatever crap they send. That happenend in the televote a lot in the past so the juries were introduced. So no, imo Jurors should NOT vote for what they like but they have to look for professional aspects in the songs. Otherwise it would make no sense if juries are just other telephone votes just that their votes have much more influence on the result.

Juries have to judge a song by the criterias above I mentioned. Unfortunately most Jurors don't do this these days. This is, amongst other reasons, the result of having only singers, hosts and other "professionals" in the juries. So let them go! :-)

 

[LalehForWD]

Don't ask how I got this.

Alright then, how did you get this?

 

[lolita]

Imo exactly this is what juries were NOT created for! Because that means all Jurors vote for their neighbour countries whatever crap they send. That happenend in the televote a lot in the past so the juries were introduced. So no, imo Jurors should NOT vote for what they like but they have to look for professional aspects in the songs. Otherwise it would make no sense if juries are just other telephone votes just that their votes have much more influence on the result.

Juries have to judge a song by the criterias above I mentioned. Unfortunately most Jurors don't do this these days. This is, amongst other reasons, the result of having only singers, hosts and other "professionals" in the juries. So let them go! :-)

Yeah, but televoters vote for show, most of the time, not for quality, so I prefer juries to stay. I am always content with their desicions, every year. I know I am alone in this, but I don't have nothing against them. Also, I am not mad when my favorite don't win because of juries, unlike many people here, because winning song is rarely my cup of tea, every year, so I am just used to it, I watch it to enjoy music and show, not to be obsessed wuth juries, results, conspiracy theories, etc. In this decade, I appreciate only Loreen, Salvador and Mans, others I don't like and listen at all, and I don't find them amazing and good, overall.

 

[Citelis]

No i want juries too! Some of their decisions are correct i believe and they also make result more interesting! I really wanted Australia to win in 2016 for example!

 

[esc87fan]

The problem with letting the juries go and going back to 100% televote is that the neighbor/diaspora/political vote will increase and countries will be focused on creating over-the-top stage shows that distract from the song (early to mid-2000s). One of the big reasons that the juries came back in the first place in 2009 was to curb the Eastern dominance and to keep televoters in check - since the juries' return 7 of the last 10 winners have come from Western countries

 

[lolita]

The problem with letting the juries go and going back to 100% televote is that the neighbor/diaspora/political vote will increase and countries will be focused on creating over-the-top stage shows that distract from the song (early to mid-2000s). One of the big reasons that the juries came back in the first place in 2009 was to curb the Eastern dominance and to keep televoters in check - since the juries' return 7 of the last 10 winners have come from Western countries

Yes, we had in the past decade Ukraine and Russia always in top 10. Even this year, with so-so song, which he had sung in unknown language, Melovin came 7th with televoting. With juries, results are more diverse and interesting, whole show is much more exciting, it is boring to see that always same countries get 12 points in televoting, like in the past decade, I always knew even before the show, who will get 12s, really, really boring and too predictable.

 

[FilipFromSweden]

Still wrong to have singing prowess be weighted when it's a SONG contest.

Singing is a huge part when it comes to competing in music

 

[Alaska49]

televote has always done a great job at voting and this block vote whining always comes from people whose countries didn't do so well in that era. ukraine and russia deserved every single top 10 placement they got last decade. juries were good to weed out the dumb and mostly western attitude ot sending corny and meritless shitshows, but now they are gone and countries seem smart enough to not go back to that. juries overrate safety and mediocrity now. they need to change their criteria or keave the contest.

 

[lolita]

Lol, my country was always in top 10, untill juries were back again. For me, it is better to have both, simply, quality winner has to appeal to both of them. And I have said countless times that other placements from 2nd to 43rd don't matter, kinda, if you haven't brought contest to your country. 2004-Lane moje 2nd, 2005-Zauvijek moja-7th, 2007-Molitva-1st, 2008- Oro-6th,..2009-Moja Cipela-out of final. Rest is out of top 10 untill nowadays. I agree that Russia and Ukraine were great in the past decade, I was fan of their entries back then, but it would be boring and unfair to have them in top 10, even when they are not good and you can't be good every year, every country has its ups and downs. Julia almost went to final this year, thanks to public vote, so, nooo.

 

[Pawhlen]

No offense to you from in here but this is their results in the televoting the latest two years they have been in the final (a little reminder for those of you who want to go back to 100% televoting)

2016

72p from neighbours

2018

65p from neighbours

 

[Realest]

No offensive to you from in here but this is their results in the televoting the latest two years they have been in the final (a little reminder for those of you who want to go back to 100% televoting)

2016

72p from neighbours

2018

65p from neighbours

Yes, Serbia and Russia cause Big Problems in the TV every year. Sanja Vucic got all Points from their Diasporahousingcountries (including Italy and Austria) and was Bottom3 in nearly all other Countries and still managed to be 11th in the Televoting because of the unfair 12 Points System. In Case of Sanja Ilic its not that extrem, but still. And Serbia has never gotten less than:

12 from Montenegro
10 from Croatia, Macedonia, Slovenia,
8 from Switzerland
4 from Austria
1 from Italy.

So 55 Points of 75 Points were guaranteed highpolitical Points which they never can not get, nomatter what the Song is. And for Russia it is similar. The EBU should increase the amount of Numbers who receive Points from 10/26 to 15-20 to reduce the Diaspora-Influence and make the Televoting fair before they go back to the 100% TV (which wont ever happen anyway).