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Thread: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

  1. Hero
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    #31

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    Quote Originally Posted by RomanFromRussia View Post
    Have you noticed following thing:
    Top 10 consists of:
    8 - male-artists
    1 - duo
    1 - Blanche

    Shhhh don't tell Gianluca.
    Likes  EscGeek, Stiven, Lupus, randajad, aef, lavieenrose, 12Points liked this post
     

    Canada WV87: A tinkly piano thing

  2. Junkie
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    #32

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    Quote Originally Posted by RomanFromRussia View Post
    Have you noticed following thing:
    Top 10 consists of:
    8 - male-artists
    1 - duo
    1 - Blanche

    READY FOR 2018

  3. Senior Member
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    #33

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    ESC 2017: Both Semi-Finals Generally
    Postcards: whilst watching the semi-finals live on the Tuesday and Thursday evenings, I didn't take much notice of the postcards; I was too busy looking at my laptop hurriedly typing in my opinions about the just finished song before the next song started. When I watched the semi-finals again on video on the Wednesday and Friday evenings I was able to pay closer attention to all parts of both semi-finals. The postcards were alright; at the end of the day they are just fillers so the host broadcaster has something to show whilst one artist leaves the stage (along with stage assistants removing any props) and the next artist enters the stage (along with stage assistants putting necessary props in place).

    Interval Acts: again I paid little attention to these when watching the semi-finals live Tuesday and Thursday evenings because both evenings I was 1) after the last song finished, finishing my blog reports by adding summary lists of the songs I wanted and didn't want in the final, 2) putting the finished report on my blog, 3) producing a mini report (which contained the summary lists of the countries I wanted and didn't want to qualify plus a few extra sentences) with a link to the applicable blog report and subsequently posting it on my Facebook timeline, several ESC Facebook groups and on ESC United Forum. In addition, on the Tuesday evening the UK voted, and therefore my attention turned to my phone to vote for my chosen countries within the 15 minute voting window. When I re-watched the semi-finals on the Wednesday and Friday evening I was able to pay full attention to the interval acts.

    Direct Qualifier Extracts: showing dress rehearsal recording extracts of the three direct qualifiers voting in that particular semi-final was better than preview video extracts of all six direct qualifiers both evenings. Having just three extracts per evening meant each one could be longer than if they showed all six both evenings, and furthermore seeing dress rehearsal recordings performed on the Kyiv stage with the accompanying set was a truer representation of the Saturday evening performance than preview video extracts.

    Announcement of Qualifiers: the manner in which this was done was good enough for me. No matter how they announce the qualifiers, this is always the nail-biting part of the semi-finals. Just like previous years, at the end of both semi-finals I was glad / over the moon when countries I wanted in the final were announced as qualified, but annoyed, appalled and/or disgusted when countries I didn't want were called out as having qualified. Likewise at the end I felt gutted / disappointed when countries I wanted in the final failed to qualify.
    I am 8 ... with 38 years experience

  4. Senior Member
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    #34

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 First Semi-Final - Tuesday 9 May 2017

    Opening
    Monatik singing the song "Spinning", accompanied by a group dancing around him; it was alright. Maybe they could have gone for something livelier, but really this was just a fill-in performance between Charpentier's Te Deum prelude and the appearance of the hosts.

    Songs
    I'll just mention a few here:
    Belgium: although "City Lights" was one of my favourites among the preview videos and on the CD album, I was unimpressed Blanche's live SF1 performance; I thought her voice wasn't strong enough, and she looked and sounded a bit nervous.
    Finland: "Blackbird" was one of the 10 Finnish national finalists I most wanted to qualify from UMK 2017, and one of my most-liked ESC 2017 entries on the CD album. Norma John gave a first class live performance, definitely one of the best SF1 entries; it's diabolical this didn't qualify.
    Azerbaijan: what was the significance of the chalkboard (and messages on it) let alone unfolding it part way through the song? Was the man with the horse's head atop the step ladder really necessary?
    Portugal: although I thought "Amar Pelos Dois" sounded old-fashioned when I first saw the online preview video, I quite liked the semi-final performance. The combination of it being a simple song, with no dancing around, graphical effects strobe lighting etc. plus it being sung in Portuguese made it stand out from the crowd. It definitely deserved to qualify and I'm not surprised it won the first semi-final with 370 points as well as the final with 758 points.
    Poland: "Flashlight" was another song I particularly liked among the preview videos and on the CD; to me it sounded like a James Bond movie theme. A powerful song, very well sung live.
    Moldova: I didn't like this song in the preview video or during the first semi-final; I think the bursts of saxophone made a below par song worse. What was the significance of the women with the bouquets? This shouldn't have qualified.
    Slovenia: "On My Way" was a simple but powerful song with a catchy chorus, and very well sung in the semi-final; this should have qualified.

    Long Breaks
    Between song 6 (Montenegro) and song 7 (Finland): UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw Eurovision Support Group, featuring the UK's 2017 artist Lucie Jones, plus various other artists who have represented various countries in ESC in past years. Together they had a discussion. I think this may have been inserted by the BBC. Did any other broadcasters (which don't show adverts) put their own filler in this slot?

    Between song 13 (Iceland) and song 14 (Czech Republic): UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw Mel Giedroyc (who was one of the UK's two commentators) speaking to Emmelie de Forest (who won for Denmark in ESC 2013) and the UK's 2017 artist Lucie Jones. Again, I think this was inserted by the BBC, and not shown in other countries or on the EBU's online international feed.

    Interval
    Recaps: Being as the UK was voting in the first semi-final, the BBC showed the first song recap just after the lines opened, the second recap after Jamala's performance of "1944" and the 60-second countdown to the lines closing. Scott Mills also told UK viewers not to vote anymore as the lines had closed. Also UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw Jamala's "1944" and "Zamanyly", plus Verka Serduchka's video, in full. The BBC didn't insert any of their own fill-in bits between the last song and the announcement of the ten qualifiers.

    Jamala "1944": it was great to see the ESC 2016 winning song being performed live again, but what was the significance of the eight other people arranged like compass points around Jamala? Were their actions really necessary?

    Verka Serduchka: the video of them in Kyiv wasn't bad (it did include a snippet of "Dancing Lasha Tumbai" tune), but I think it would have been better if Verka Serduchka had performed "Dancing Lasha Tumbai" live on stage in Kyiv.

    Jamala "Zamanyly": an unusual style of song which you either like or don't. Does anyone know what language she sang in? What was the significance of her costume, and the coloured animated figures on the background screen?

    Direct qualifier clips: Spain, UK, Italy. In all three cases this featured one of the hosts speaking to the applicable artist followed by the relevant clip.

    Announcement of Qualifiers
    My desired qualifiers: Australia, Finland, Portugal, Greece, Poland, Czech Republic, Cyprus, Slovenia, plus two (and no more) of Sweden, Belgium, Azerbaijan.

    Actual qualifiers (in order of announcement): Moldova, Azerbaijan, Greece, Sweden, Portugal, Poland, Armenia, Australia, Cyprus, Belgium.

    Bold entries represent the actual qualifiers that match my preferences.

    OUT: Georgia, Albania, Montenegro, Finland, Iceland, Czech Republic, Slovenia, Latvia.

    I was gutted and deeply upset that Finland and Slovenia failed to qualify as I thought they were two of the best songs in the first semi-final. At the other extreme I was appalled and disgusted Moldova as I detested their entry. To a lesser degree I was annoyed Armenia qualified, as I didn't like their song. In my opinion, Finland and Slovenia deserved the places Armenia and Moldova took.

    Close
    UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw Scott Mills talking to Lucie Jones whilst the BBC showed its own credits at the bottom of the screen. Did any other broadcasters show their own credits in place of the host broadcaster's credits?

    A more detailed review of the first semi-final, containing my points of view about all 18 songs and the qualifiers / non-qualifiers is available here:
    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 First Semi-Final
    I am 8 ... with 38 years experience

  5. Senior Member
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    #35

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 Second Semi-Final - Thursday 11 May 2017

    Opening
    After a series of clips from the first semi-final, Oleksandr and Volodymir played some Eurovision hits Ukranian style. They were accompanied onstage by dancers and singers. Interestingly one of the song excerpts was "My Number One" by Helena Paparizou; presumably that was included as it won for Greece in ESC 2005 (which also came from Kyiv). Altogether this opening was much better than the one in the first semi-final Tuesday evening.

    Songs
    I'll just mention a few here:
    Romania: a rather silly song consisting mainly of yodelling and rap; I didn't like this in the preview video, on the CD or sung live in the second semi-final. This shouldn't have qualified.
    The Netherlands: their entry featured an unusual style of singing, which is not to my taste, but anyway the three ladies performed it very well live, with good harmony.
    Hungary: from the moment I first saw an online video of the winning performance of "Origo" shortly after A Dal 2017 Final ended I didn't like this entry. I disliked it performed live in the second semi-final just as much; to me it seemed a very unusual style of singing and the rap made a bad song worse.
    Ireland: one of the entries I particularly liked among the preview videos and on the CD. I thought Brendan gave a great performance of an excellent song in the second semi-final; although rather quiet for the first two thirds, the final chorus was really powerful. What was the significance of the balloon though? It's a pity this didn't qualify.
    Norway: one of my least-liked 2017 entries among the preview videos and on the CD, and I hated JOWST's live second semi-final performance. Although the chorus was memorable, the song was generally below par. What was the significance of the pixilation at various moments? I was appalled this qualified.
    Bulgaria: one of my most-liked ballads among the preview videos and on the CD. It was an excellent ballad and very well sung live, in fact "Beautiful Mess" was one of the best songs in the second semi-final. This definitely deserved to qualify; I'm not surprised this won the second semi-final with 403 points and finished second in the final with 615 points.
    Estonia: one of my favourites among the preview videos and on the CD, I enjoyed "Verona" sung live just as much. It was very catchy; I thought Koit and Laura gave the first class performance I expected. This was the song I most wanted to qualify; it's diabolical it didn't.

    Long Breaks
    Between song 6 (The Netherlands) and song 7 (Hungary): UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw part one of a three-part drama The Force, starring Mel Giedroyc and Scott Mills. Their mission was to find the lost Eurovision winner's trophy. Part two of this drama was shown during the break between song 13 (Switzerland) and song 14 (Belarus). Both of these must have been inserted by the BBC. Did any other broadcasters (which don't show adverts) put their own filler in these slots?

    Interval
    Recaps: The UK didn't vote in the second semi-final. Presumably that's why the BBC only showed the first song recap just after the lines opened, with the caption "UK viewers cannot vote tonight" at the bottom of the screen. Next the BBC showed Verka Serduchka's video, which must have been part of the main EBU feed. However after that the BBC showed Eurovision Hotel Kyiv (a video showing Mel Giedroyc talking to some ESC 2017 artists) followed by the final instalment of the three-part drama The Force. As a result, UK viewers watching on BBC Four missed the second recap of the songs and the countdown to the lines closing. After another short speech from Mel Giedroyc (including her statement "the vote is closed here"), the BBC showed the stage act Apache CREW performing The Children's Courtyard. Personally I'd rather the BBC had shown the proper coverage throughout the interval instead of putting their own fillers in.

    Verka Serduchka: the video must have been a continuation of the one in the first semi-final, this time having a clip of their ESC 2007 Final performance on a TV. I still think it would have been better if Verka Serduchka had performed "Dancing Lasha Tumbai" live on stage in Kyiv in just one semi-final (say the first) and something else had been put in the interval of the other semi-final.

    Apache CREW performing The Children's Courtyard: a well-choreographed dance routine on the main stage. However what was the significance of the man and woman who did some movements on the small stage at one point?

    N.B. When Apache CREW finished the BBC suddenly cut to Mel Giedroyc and Scott Mills who gave UK viewers another speech. Once their speech ended UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw the Celebrate Diversity sting, followed by one of the hosts talking to Alma (representing France). This has made me wonder if the BBC showed Apache CREW on a slight delay, to fit in with their own insertions, before returning to live broadcast from the direct qualifier clips onwards.

    Direct qualifier clips: France, Germany, Ukraine. In all three cases this featured one of the hosts speaking to the applicable artist followed by the relevant clip.

    Announcement of Qualifiers
    My desired qualifiers: Serbia, Austria, Malta, Denmark, Ireland, Croatia, Belarus, Bulgaria, Estonia, Israel.

    Actual qualifiers (in order of announcement): Bulgaria, Belarus, Croatia, Hungary, Denmark, Israel, Romania, Norway, The Netherlands, Austria.

    Bold entries represent the actual qualifiers that match my preferences.

    OUT: Serbia, F.Y.R. Macedonia, Malta, Ireland, San Marino, Switzerland, Lithuania, Estonia.

    I was gutted and shocked Estonia didn't qualify because "Verona" was the one song I most wanted to qualify. Also I was gutted Ireland didn't qualify, because I really liked "Dying to Try" and felt it was one of the entries most deserving of a place in the final. At the other extreme, I was appalled and disgusted Romania and Norway qualified, as they were on the list of countries I least wanted in the final. As far as I'm concerned Estonia and Ireland deserved the places Romania and Norway took.

    Close
    UK viewers watching on BBC Four saw Scott Mills commenting on which countries qualified, and those which didn't, whilst the BBC showed its own credits at the bottom of the screen. Did any other broadcasters show their own credits in place of the host broadcaster's credits?

    A more detailed review of the second semi-final, containing my points of view about all 18 songs and the qualifiers / non-qualifiers is available here:
    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 Second Semi-Final
    I am 8 ... with 38 years experience

  6. Senior Member
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    #36

    Re: ESC2017 - Overall Reactions

    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 Grand Final - Saturday 13 May 2017

    Songs
    I'll just mention a few here:
    Italy: this was among my most-liked songs in the Grand Final. It was a lively catchy song, predominantly in Italian, and very well sung live. What was the significance of the gorilla and the various background screen images? I think this should have finished top five overall, but I'm not sure this was good enough to win.
    Spain: I didn't think much of "Do It For Your Lover" this song from the moment I first saw its online preview video, and the Grand final performance still failed to impress me. However I liked the simulated surf boards on stage and the background scene. It's hardly surprising this finished last with 5 points overall. Although this deserved to finish near bottom, I would have preferred to have seen Moldova, Norway, Romania and Ukraine, all of which I thought were worse still, placed below Spain.
    United Kingdom: an excellent ballad, very well sung live in the final. The flying stars in the background added to its impact. Definitely one of the better finalists. This certainly ought to have finished top ten in both jury and public voting, and overall; maybe even top five overall, but it was clearly not worthy of winning the Contest.
    Germany: "Perfect Life" was a reasonable ballad which was quite well sung live during the final, but not particularly memorable. I'm not surprised this finished 25th (second last) with 6 points overall. Although a bottom 6 result was expected, I would have preferred to have seen the entries from Moldova, Norway, Romania and Ukraine placed below Germany.
    Ukraine: the host entry was a rock song "Time". Although this style of rock is not my taste in music, I think this was one of the worst songs in the Grand Final. What was the significance of the giant head? This ended up where it belonged, 24th place with 36 points overall.
    Belgium: after my disappointment with Blanche's live performance of "City Lights" in the First Semi-Final, her Grand Final performance was a significant improvement, but I still felt her voice wasn't strong enough for most of the song. I think 4th with 363 points overall was a bit high; 9th or 10th would have been a more appropriate combined placing.
    France: one of my most-liked songs among the preview videos and on the CD album. Going by the Grand Final performance alone, it was quite a nice song and very well sung live in a mixture of French and English. The graphics were impressive too. One of the better finalists, but by the end it was obvious to me this wouldn't win. This should have finished 8th to 10th in both voting schemes and overall.

    Grossly over-rated: Moldova, Norway, Romania (all should have finished in the bottom four, just like Ukraine did)
    Grossly under-rated: Poland (deserved top five overall)
    Under-rated by public: Austria, Australia, United Kingdom
    Under-rated by juries: France

    Interval and Televoting
    The BBC showed all the recaps and all the staged interval acts. They didn't put any of their own substitute fillers in at any point for UK viewers.

    I must admit, I missed much of what came up during the interval on the night, because I wanted to vote for several countries (I deliberately waited quite some time into the voting window to ensure lines wouldn't be engaged when I dialled; thankfully I managed to get through whenever I tried). The interval was also a handy moment for me to make a cup of coffee, go to the toilet, post ESC related messages on Facebook and even take a few pictures of myself watching the ESC (using the self-timer on my digital camera atop a tripod), all of which diverted my attention from the interval acts. Anyway I've since paid full attention to the staged interval acts when re-watching the final on video. I don't think the acts a) Ruslana - "It's Magical" (and her dancers), b) ONUKA featuring the NAONI Orchestra – Megamix or c) Jamala "I Believe in U" were as memorable as Måns Zelmerlöw and Petra Mede – "Love Love Peace Peace" in 2016, but nonetheless they served their purpose adequately. At the end of the day, those interval acts are really just fillers to entertain viewers between song recaps during the televoting window (which in the current two-part voting system really does need to be about 30 to 40 minutes to give people adequate time to vote). 1994 was unusual in having an interval act "Riverdance" which became a greater commercial success than the 25 competing songs; I don't see a similar scenario happening with another ESC Grand Final interval act in the foreseeable future.

    Back to 2017, I didn't even know there had been a stage invasion during Jamala's "I Believe in U" until I read about it online somewhere a day or two after the final; only after reading that and subsequently re-watching that particular act did I watch out for and first notice the stage invader. Thankfully he was removed quickly by one of the officials

    Jury Results
    I noticed this time announcement of the jury results very shortly after the televoting lines closed. That was a good time-saving measure; fitting in one or two more interval acts between closure of the televoting lines and starting the jury vote announcement would have been a pointless waste of time.

    Sweden (who hosted in 2016) announced first and Ukraine (who hosted in 2017) announced last. Presumably it's now become a tradition to start with the country that hosted the previous year and finish with the current host country.

    Points announcement by country: showing the 1-8 and 10 points at the foot of the screen whilst the spokesperson says "Thank you for an incredible evening" (or similar), adding them to the scoreboard and verbally announcing just the 12 points is fine by me. Obviously you've got to read the 1-8 and 10 point scores yourself, but at least it keeps your mind alert; I found it's best to start reading them as soon as they appear at the bottom of the screen. From the last 2 years (2016 and 2017), that announcement method has enabled the host broadcaster to get through all 42 countries' jury votes on the scoreboard in 30 to 35 minutes, which is important considering announcing the televoting totals takes another 10 minutes or so afterwards. Basically this method is a time-saving compromise, you read the 1-8 and 10 points yourself, whilst awaiting the excitement of the spokesperson announcing the 12 points. If your country isn't among the 1-8 and 10 points listed, you can still hope your country will be the one with the top score of 12 jury points.

    Televoting Results
    Undeniably this was the most nail-biting moment of the evening. Due to the way the televoting totals were announced from the lowest to the highest, the later your country was called the greater the number of points it would get. No doubt viewers in every finalist country were hoping their country would be called as late as possible.

    As a UK resident, I was hoping the UK would be called as late as possible. When the first few televoting totals (0, 2, 3, 5 and another 5) were called, I was glad when none of those were UK as I didn't want the UK to end up with fewer televoting points this year than the 8 televoting points it received last year. When "With 8 points it is" was called, I still hoped it wouldn't be UK, as I thought the UK deserved more than 8 televoting points this time; thankfully the 8 points were for Denmark. However when the next televote total, 12 points was called, I was disappointed it was the UK, as I felt "Never Give Up On You" deserved more televote points than that. Thankfully that was four more than the UK got on televoting last year and a higher televote placing (20th instead of 25th).

    Likewise I hoped that Portugal and Bulgaria, both of which finished top two on jury voting, and favourites to win, would be called as late as possible; in fact I hoped Portugal would hold its lead until the end. Consequently I hoped the first few (lowest) televote totals wouldn't be Portugal or Bulgaria as well as the UK, and once the UK had received its 12 televote points, I continued hoping neither Portugal nor Bulgaria would be among the countries placed 19th to 11th in the public vote. After that I hoped neither Portugal nor Bulgaria would be among the 10th to 5th placed countries. In the end I was so glad Bulgaria finished second and Portugal won the televote, putting them second and first respectively overall; they deserved it.

    The biggest shock was seeing Australia score just 2 televote points after finishing 4th with 171 points in the jury vote. Basically this was the opposite way around to Poland last year.

    I was surprised to see such a large number of countries (6 altogether) get less than 10 televoting points, and even Azerbaijan which finished 11th on the public vote score just 42 televoting points. After that I was surprised to see a sudden leap in points between 11th placed Azerbaijan and 10th placed France with 90 televote points. At the top end of the public vote, I was surprised to see the top 6 countries all get more than 200 televote points (last year only the top 3 got more than 200 points on televoting).

    A more detailed review of the Grand Final, containing my points of view about all 26 songs, as well as an outline of the jury and televoting results, is available here:
    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 Grand Final

    A separate report containing an in-depth analysis of the jury and televoting is available here:
    Eurovision Song Contest 2017 Grand Final Extended Voting Analysis

    To have some idea of how the results would have appeared if the 42 national spokespersons had announced the televoting results first, and the hosts had announced the jury totals last, click the following link:
    Alternative Voting Presentation
    I am 8 ... with 38 years experience

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