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escYOUnited
2nd May 2015, 19:45
http://s27.postimg.org/81bylkzc3/KAZAKHSTAN.png

Sabiondo
2nd May 2015, 21:09
As ::au is taking part (Non associated member), EBU don't have any excuses to keep ::kz out from Eurovision & EBU membership, even they are outside the European broadcasting area.

Hopefully they at least accept Kazakhstan as non associated member due their loyalty in Broadcast live ESC from 2007.

And if Kazakhstan are accepted to join in ESC, Kesh You is my favorite suggestion for make a great debut xheartxheart


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqGT_AeyPpg

Matt
2nd May 2015, 21:36
Kazakhstan is one of the main reasons I was opposed to Australia joining the contest. Yes, there are tons of Australian fans, who are traveling across the globe to attend the event and it's immensely popular there. However, Kazakhstan has been trying to join the Eurovision family for years and is still waiting. So hopefully now that the contest is evolving into something that goes beyond the EBU borders, it only makes sense to let them in as well.

The fact that Kazakhstan is sending a delegation to Vienna, is giving me some hope that there may be a chance we'll see them in 2016. How awesome would that be?

Tinchey
2nd May 2015, 23:15
Kazakhstan actually has a part of the territory in Europe. I would love to see them in, Ukraine can take another break year for all I care. ^^

Archer
3rd May 2015, 18:28
As tradition has it, here's hoping for Ulytau this year as well.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6MLF7S8pOo

Though they'll need some vocals.

Gera11
3rd May 2015, 22:18
::kz for 2016 pleaaaase xpray xcheer They have a lot of potential

Sabiondo
19th May 2015, 03:18
Its seems that ::kz is not longer interested in Eurovision :( since Khabar TV this year opted not to Broadcast the show, due to the low rates of views of competition among Kazakh TV viewers over the past years.

A-lister
22nd May 2015, 00:50
Well... if they gonna let Australia in permanently (hope they won't) then there are no arguments left for not letting in Kazakhstan which unlike Australia (which is almost as far from Europe as you can possibly get geographically) actually has a continental European part while the rest is a direct neighbor to Europe.

Sean
22nd May 2015, 17:47
Its seems that ::kz is not longer interested in Eurovision :( since Khabar TV this year opted not to Broadcast the show, due to the low rates of views of competition among Kazakh TV viewers over the past years.

They sent a delegation this year

grazy2266
24th May 2015, 01:37
I would love to see them in 2016 contest.

Quent91
24th May 2015, 16:12
Sorry but no, we have more links with Australia, which have european roots, than Kazakhstan.

DanielLuis
24th May 2015, 16:19
Sorry but no, we have more links with Australia, which have european roots, than Kazakhstan.

Well, Kazhakstan actually is in Europe.
Plus you're forgetting Europe is not just western Europe. And the eastern countries definitely do have more links to Kazhakstan than to Australia.

A-lister
25th May 2015, 00:14
Sorry but no, we have more links with Australia, which have european roots, than Kazakhstan.

Ehm? Australia is almost as far geographically from Europe as it could possibly get.

There's more to Europe than Western Europe and the UK you know that right? If we allow a country which is the most far away from Europe one could get, but close the door to a country that is IN Europe... then it's just hypocritical and the judgment is based solely on an Anglo/West-centric world-view and a ranking of countries, cultures and languages and nothing else...

FaWa
25th May 2015, 17:17
Agreed, Kazakhstan really deserves to make their debut.

Mii11
25th May 2015, 19:12
I would love to see ::kz debuting, but I'm afraid that it will strengthen bloc voting. It's not hard to predict who would they be voting for...

A-lister
25th May 2015, 19:16
I would love to see ::kz debuting, but I'm afraid that it will strengthen bloc voting. It's not hard to predict who would they be voting for...

Might very well happen, but then again should we allow a country that is on the other side of the planet because it belongs to the "right culture" but not a European country because of potential bloc voting of the "wrong countries"? I'd say that reasoning is very scary...

Mii11
25th May 2015, 19:29
Might very well happen, but then again should we allow a country that is on the other side of the planet because it belongs to the "right culture" but not a European country because of potential bloc voting of the "wrong countries"? I'd say that reasoning is very scary...

Well, that's true. I think allowing ::au to participate was a big mistake, because now every country outside of Europe can claim their right to participate. EBU cannot refuse ::kz to participate as it is partially in Europe, unlike Australia - and if the rumors that Kazakh delegation was present in Vienna, then I think it's clear that the debut is inevitable.

A-lister
25th May 2015, 20:12
Well, that's true. I think allowing ::au to participate was a big mistake, because now every country outside of Europe can claim their right to participate. EBU cannot refuse ::kz to participate as it is partially in Europe, unlike Australia - and if the rumors that Kazakh delegation was present in Vienna, then I think it's clear that the debut is inevitable.

I always thought that their reasoning for not allowing ::kz (which is partly within continental Europe) was dubious, and with allowing (and potentially permanent) Australia it proves even further that EBU only talk cr*p.

I don't think Australia should be let back, they did their anniversary thing and they didn't win so that's that... and like you said making them permanent will make other arguments against non-European countries entering (and especially countries that ARE partly European) look very hypocritical...

Krishoes
2nd June 2015, 03:58
Will the Expo 2017 help ::kz to join the EBU and the Eurovision? Just wondering with no-sense connections! :mrgreen:

Archer
2nd June 2015, 05:19
It's not hard to predict who would they be voting for...

They'd give 8 to Russia, 10 and 12 to Turkey and Azerbaijan (not sure who would get which)

Bloc voting is an uncontrollable reality in the contest, we should try to live with it. Just enjoy the contest, it doesn't determine the winner for most of the time.

southernstars
2nd June 2015, 13:00
Ehm? Australia is almost as far geographically from Europe as it could possibly get.

That's true, but Quent91 is right when he talks about Australia's European roots, and NOT just 'western' European roots either. Some stats for you:

According to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, on 30 June 2014 there were 6.6 million residents who were born outside Australia, representing 28% of the total population.

In the 2011 census, 60.2% of Australia's population declared European ancestry.

At the 2011 Census residents were asked to describe their ancestry, in which up to two could be nominated. Proportionate to the Australian resident population, the most commonly nominated ancestries were: SEE HERE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Australia#Ancestry_of_Australian_p opulation)

As you can see at the above link, we have lots of Europeans here, first, second AND third generation.

I also know a few Turkish Australians, loads from former Yugoslavia countries as well. Me personally: my dad was born in England and Mum Australian, but of Prussian-German descent. In my own office we have people who were born in, or descended from these countries: Poland, Germany, Slovenia, Serbia, Croatia, Italy, Greece, Romania, Ukraine (lots of EASTERN countries, are there not?!?!).

But anyway, this isn't a post being against Kazakhstan, far from it. I would personally love to see Kazakhstan there because it's a link to Central Asia, which has some amazing music and the Turkic languages are BEAUTIFUL. Central Asian culture is fascinating too. But to say that Australia isn't European at all, and therefore not worthy of being in Eurovision again, is actually an insult. Australia has MASSIVE ties to Europe, as aforementioned. Europeans pretty much built up and made our country the way it is today. Without them, we'd be nothing (not just talking the British, either). There's a reason why they say we are 'multicultural'; culturally, we are more 'Europe' than Kazakhstan. Geographically, obviously not. In closing, I'm thankful for our one opportunity and would like to think we'd be invited again in the future, but I do not think we should be made a permanent member.

And to lighten up this post a bit, here's a cool Kazakh song:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kf_sKId99xg
(it even has an epic fighting scene)

ElRuso
2nd June 2015, 15:03
They'd give 8 to Russia, 10 and 12 to Turkey and Azerbaijan (not sure who would get which)

Bloc voting is an uncontrollable reality in the contest, we should try to live with it. Just enjoy the contest, it doesn't determine the winner for most of the time.

Really? 12 to ::ru, 10 to ::ua and 8 to ::az. At least in televoting. ::tr might get 7 or 6 depending if ::by qualifies or not.

Archer
2nd June 2015, 20:45
Really? 12 to ::ru, 10 to ::ua and 8 to ::az. At least in televoting. ::tr might get 7 or 6 depending if ::by qualifies or not.

Yeaaa suure

ElRuso
2nd June 2015, 20:52
Yeaaa suure

Well, I know of Pan-Turkism, but come on. Kazakhs are not as pro-Turkish as Azerbaijani. Also, 25% of Kazakh population is ethnic Russians. And many Kazakhs speak Russian better than Kazakh. Also think, that Russia rarely votes for Turkey, despite Tatars that are the biggest minority here, Bashkirs, Tuvans, and other Turkic minorities.

ElRuso
2nd June 2015, 21:04
Yeaaa suure

Oh, and dont forget about Turkvision voting. When, Turkey gained last place, because of Sinan Akcil.

pyryniemi
3rd June 2015, 01:10
I really want ::kz in....especially because of that awesome flag and KeshYou xlove but I'm afraid they could turn into Azerbaijan 2.0 :?

Archer
3rd June 2015, 03:34
Well, I know of Pan-Turkism, but come on. Kazakhs are not as pro-Turkish as Azerbaijani. Also, 25% of Kazakh population is ethnic Russians. And many Kazakhs speak Russian better than Kazakh. Also think, that Russia rarely votes for Turkey, despite Tatars that are the biggest minority here, Bashkirs, Tuvans, and other Turkic minorities.

I'm sure ethnic Kazakhs would not vote for Russia instead of Turkey or Azerbaijan.

Hopefully they'll participate next year so I'll be proven right.

LesterMalvo
3rd June 2015, 04:03
I am fine with Kazakhstan participating as long as they don't send something ethnic or cultural.

Archer
3rd June 2015, 06:20
I am fine with Kazakhstan participating as long as they don't send something ethnic or cultural.

:confused:

LesterMalvo
3rd June 2015, 06:41
:confused:

I usually dislike that kind of cultural songs. Once I tried to attend Turkvision, it was such a waste of time to me. I could barely watch it for half an hour. I only enjoy "Jan Jan" from Armenia in 2009, that's all. And I don't think I'll be lucky enough to meet such good ethnic music.

Archer
3rd June 2015, 06:52
I usually dislike that kind of cultural songs. Once I tried to attend Turkvision, it was such a waste of time to me. I could barely watch it for half an hour. I only enjoy "Jan Jan" from Armenia in 2009, that's all. And I don't think I'll be lucky enough to meet such good ethnic music.

Never watched Turkvision, but Kazakh ethnic music is good enough, I'd prefer a symphonic Rock entry with folk melodies *hinting at Ulytau*

ElRuso
3rd June 2015, 10:04
I'm sure ethnic Kazakhs would not vote for Russia instead of Turkey or Azerbaijan.

Hopefully they'll participate next year so I'll be proven right.

Of course some of the ethnic Kazakhs would vote for Turkey and Azerbaijan, because it is Turkey and Azerbaijan, but still. Many Kazakhs do not know Kazakh language, and most of them are secular. Not to mention that Kazahks are Sunni and Azerbaijanis are Shia. And of course there is a connection between Kazakhstan and Turkey, but connection with Russia is much stronger. I think that even connection with China is stronger.


Currently you have the strongest connection with Azerbaijan, Russian Crimean Tatars, and Turks of abroad.

And again, think that Tatars are the second most populated nation in Russia after Russians, does Russia give at least 5 points to Turkey every year?

Edit: read this with the help of google translate - https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%B5%D0%B6%D1%8D%D1%82%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%87%D 0%B5%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BD%D1 %84%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%82_%D0%BD%D0%B0_%D0%BC%D0 %B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B4%D0%B 5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B8_%C2%AB%D0%A2%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B3 %D0%B8%D0%B7%C2%BB

Nikoreindeer1973
3rd June 2015, 11:29
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zPCv0JAq5tU

Archer
3rd June 2015, 12:07
Of course some of the ethnic Kazakhs would vote for Turkey and Azerbaijan, because it is Turkey and Azerbaijan, but still. Many Kazakhs do not know Kazakh language, and most of them are secular. Not to mention that Kazahks are Sunni and Azerbaijanis are Shia. And of course there is a connection between Kazakhstan and Turkey, but connection with Russia is much stronger. I think that even connection with China is stronger.


Currently you have the strongest connection with Azerbaijan, Russian Crimean Tatars, and Turks of abroad.

And again, think that Tatars are the second most populated nation in Russia after Russians, does Russia give at least 5 points to Turkey every year?

Edit: read this with the help of google translate - https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%B5%D0%B6%D1%8D%D1%82%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%87%D 0%B5%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BD%D1 %84%D0%BB%D0%B8%D0%BA%D1%82_%D0%BD%D0%B0_%D0%BC%D0 %B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B6%D0%B4%D0%B 5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B8_%C2%AB%D0%A2%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B3 %D0%B8%D0%B7%C2%BB

What's it to do with Kazakhs being secular? you mean Turks and Azeris are not? Turkic peoples in general are secular anyway and share in no way the same mindset as other Muslims. Connection with Russia is of course strong due to some reasons, but Kazakhstan is well-aware of their identity that's why they are a member of Turkic Council.

Azeris are only Shi'a on the paper, they don't even call themselves Shi'a and their ethnic feelings come much before religion, let alone sect. You see Turks and Azeris saying for each other one nation with two states, despite being respectively Sunni and Shi'a on the paper. The relationship amongst Turkic peoples is more of a cultural bond and religion plays not much role in it.

I assume Tatars don't know much about Eurovision or simply don't care. They'd of course give high points if they participated themselves.

ElRuso
3rd June 2015, 13:15
What's it to do with Kazakhs being secular? you mean Turks and Azeris are not? Turkic peoples in general are secular anyway and share in no way the same mindset as other Muslims. Connection with Russia is of course strong due to some reasons, but Kazakhstan is well-aware of their identity that's why they are a member of Turkic Council.

Azeris are only Shi'a on the paper, they don't even call themselves Shi'a and their ethnic feelings come much before religion, let alone sect. You see Turks and Azeris saying for each other one nation with two states, despite being respectively Sunni and Shi'a on the paper. The relationship amongst Turkic peoples is more of a cultural bond and religion plays not much role in it.

I assume Tatars don't know much about Eurovision or simply don't care. They'd of course give high points if they participated themselves.

Yes Tatars "do not know nothing" about Eurovision. Alsou and Dina Garipova are Tatars, and Eurovision is popular in Tatarstan. But, it seems that you believe that all Kazakhs will vote for Turkey, because they are of Turkic origin. Lets see then.

Mickey
6th June 2015, 12:38
To clarify, it is possible for Kazakhstan to join Eurovision at some point. To become an active member of the EBU a country needs to be "a member country of the International Telecommunication Union (ITU) situated in the European Broadcasting Area as defined by the Radio Regulations annexed to the International Telecommunication Convention, or a member country of the Council of Europe which is situated outside the European Broadcasting Area"

As Kazakhstan aren't in the European Broadcasting Area, they need to join the Council of Europe. Their small bit of European territory will qualify them for that, but they also need to satisfy various political conditions.

GRE
6th June 2015, 12:43
To clarify, it is possible for Kazakhstan to join Eurovision at some point. To become an active member of the EBU a country needs to be "a member country of the International Telecommunication Union (ITU) situated in the European Broadcasting Area as defined by the Radio Regulations annexed to the International Telecommunication Convention, or a member country of the Council of Europe which is situated outside the European Broadcasting Area"

As Kazakhstan aren't in the European Broadcasting Area, they need to join the Council of Europe. Their small bit of European territory will qualify them for that, but they also need to satisfy various political conditions.

With all the respect to your opinion,
it seems that EBU doesn't need so many reasons to bring a country in. :rolleyes:
Just

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETxmCCsMoD0

Mickey
6th June 2015, 12:57
With all the respect to your opinion,
it seems that EBU doesn't need so many reasons to bring a country in. :rolleyes:
Just

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETxmCCsMoD0

Of course, the fact the Reference Group can choose to completely ignore their own rules is well established. It's just, in this case, they don't necessarily have to.

tuorem
16th June 2015, 18:49
I guess Kazakhstan would be in for a long time had the EBU cared about them, seems like a Kazakh debut isn't sexy enough for them :?

vlatko
8th July 2015, 22:17
I hope Kazakhstan and Liban next year be in Sweden.

A-lister
9th July 2015, 14:54
What's this discussion about Kazakhstan supporting Turkey rather than Russia in ESC? Kazakhstan is politically, culturally and socially closer to Russia actually. With that said there is no denying that they belong to the Turkic "cultural and linguistic" family, but the ties are much stronger to Russia nonetheless and I'd argue even to other ex-USSR countries than Turkey (so yes Azerbaijan could also benefit from a Kazakh debut being both Turkic and ex-USSR in the same time).

Anyways these are just hypothetical speculations to whom Kazakhstan will give their main support in ESC. Chances seem to be zero to see Kazakhstan in the contest though because it's apparent that EBU is having a western/Anglo-centric perspective regarding ESC which means that they have no problem enter the door to countries like Australia that are as far from Europe geographically as possible only due to it having the "right culture" rather than partly European countries like Kazakhstan. It's a shame but it shows the true colors of EBU and their ignorant mindset.

Archer
12th July 2015, 23:46
What's this discussion about Kazakhstan supporting Turkey rather than Russia in ESC? Kazakhstan is politically, culturally and socially closer to Russia actually. With that said there is no denying that they belong to the Turkic "cultural and linguistic" family, but the ties are much stronger to Russia nonetheless and I'd argue even to other ex-USSR countries than Turkey (so yes Azerbaijan could also benefit from a Kazakh debut being both Turkic and ex-USSR in the same time).

Anyways these are just hypothetical speculations to whom Kazakhstan will give their main support in ESC. Chances seem to be zero to see Kazakhstan in the contest though because it's apparent that EBU is having a western/Anglo-centric perspective regarding ESC which means that they have no problem enter the door to countries like Australia that are as far from Europe geographically as possible only due to it having the "right culture" rather than partly European countries like Kazakhstan. It's a shame but it shows the true colors of EBU and their ignorant mindset.

If anything I want Kazakhstan to participate for the sole reason I want to see your face. Keep believin' in your bull*hit. I'm sure you would say same things for Azerbaijan hadn't they participated.

LesterMalvo
13th July 2015, 02:33
What's this discussion about Kazakhstan supporting Turkey rather than Russia in ESC? Kazakhstan is politically, culturally and socially closer to Russia actually. With that said there is no denying that they belong to the Turkic "cultural and linguistic" family, but the ties are much stronger to Russia nonetheless and I'd argue even to other ex-USSR countries than Turkey (so yes Azerbaijan could also benefit from a Kazakh debut being both Turkic and ex-USSR in the same time).

Anyways these are just hypothetical speculations to whom Kazakhstan will give their main support in ESC. Chances seem to be zero to see Kazakhstan in the contest though because it's apparent that EBU is having a western/Anglo-centric perspective regarding ESC which means that they have no problem enter the door to countries like Australia that are as far from Europe geographically as possible only due to it having the "right culture" rather than partly European countries like Kazakhstan. It's a shame but it shows the true colors of EBU and their ignorant mindset.

I don't think countries should be criticized unless they participate. If Azerbaijan wouldn't participate, I'd expect them to send ethnic and preferably boring entries which almost never qualify in case they participate. But they send more "European" entries than many others and they are one of the most successful countries of Eurovision. So you shouldn't put Kazakhstan in a situation without a chance them to show themselves.

A-lister
13th July 2015, 16:16
I don't think countries should be criticized unless they participate. If Azerbaijan wouldn't participate, I'd expect them to send ethnic and preferably boring entries which almost never qualify in case they participate. But they send more "European" entries than many others and they are one of the most successful countries of Eurovision. So you shouldn't put Kazakhstan in a situation without a chance them to show themselves.

Huh?? Surely you must have quoted the wrong person because this response has nothing to do with my comment??? When did I criticize Kazakhstan here? On contrary I'm one of the strongest supporters of them entering xshrug

A-lister
13th July 2015, 16:19
If anything I want Kazakhstan to participate for the sole reason I want to see your face. Keep believin' in your bull*hit. I'm sure you would say same things for Azerbaijan hadn't they participated.

See my face when I happen to be correct when your nationalist idea about pan-Turkey doesn't show to be quite accurate? Yes, be my guest...

I love how saying Kazakhstan is closer to Russia (which it is) is really annoying you this much as if it's somehow criticism against Turkey!? (but then again, if I even mention "Turkey" in any other sentences you will see this as criticism... regardless of what it can be) xshrug

Azerbaijan is way closer to Turkey than Kazakhstan is so I wouldn't put them two in the same boat.

Krishoes
18th December 2015, 11:45
Khabar Television, the state broadcaster of Kazakhstan, is to join the European Broadcasting Union on January 1st.

http://khabar.kz/ru/news/obshchestvo/item/41898-s-1-yanvarya-telekanal-khabar-vstupaet-v-evropejskij-veshchatelnyj-soyuz

AlekS
18th December 2015, 12:00
They've been having negotiations about entering ESC for few years. Imo there's a high chance to see them on ESC 2017.

lowyby
18th December 2015, 12:04
The EBU could be extra nice though and let them enter in 2016, just as they did with Australia entering in february :P

GianlucaTomoe
18th December 2015, 12:06
Kazakhstan will join EBU as an Associate member though, so this means it's still not eligible to take part in ESC.

Chorizo
18th December 2015, 12:09
I don't want them to join because that would be one more country that gives all its top points to its neighbors.

GianlucaTomoe
18th December 2015, 12:14
I don't want them to join because that would be one more country that gives all its top points to its neighbors.

They can't join anyway, EBU has just twitted this to me: https://twitter.com/EBU_HQ/status/677808403180347392

Krishoes
18th December 2015, 12:15
Kazakhstan will join EBU as an Associate member though, so this means it's still not eligible to take part in ESC.

Australia xroflxrofl2

AlekS
18th December 2015, 12:17
Kazakhstan will join EBU as an Associate member though, so this means it's still not eligible to take part in ESC.
They always tried to submit as an active member + they had negotiations to do this as an exception.
Australian SBS is Associate Member.

AlekS
18th December 2015, 12:22
They can't join anyway, EBU has just twitted this to me: https://twitter.com/EBU_HQ/status/677808403180347392

Associate Member SBS can take part in ESC and it was invited by the EBU.
Associate Member Khabar can't take part in ESC 2017 because it's against the rules... no comments.

The main reason are low TV ratings anyway, according to Andy. With such attitude all negotiations are useless imo.

GRE
18th December 2015, 13:17
In oikotimes they are very furious about this development :o

http://oikotimes.com/2015/12/18/we-had-it-all-and-now-we-might-have-kazakstan-too/

PamSwynford
18th December 2015, 14:11
Someone should contact his shrink.

Chorizo
18th December 2015, 14:31
They can't join anyway, EBU has just twitted this to me: https://twitter.com/EBU_HQ/status/677808403180347392

"Under current rules" as they say.
We know how fast that can change.

Stiven
18th December 2015, 15:17
The main reason are low TV ratings anyway, according to Andy. With such attitude all negotiations are useless imo.
Okay so I got interested and decided to see the Kazakh viewing figures and well:

TV rating of the broadcast of the show in Kazakhstan according to TNS Central Asia data were as following:
May 25 live at 01.00 - 0.4%
May 26 recorded at 17.00 - 1.6%
May 27 live at 01.00 - 0.6%
May 28 recorded at 17.00 - 1.3%
May 29 live at 01.00 - 0.9%
May 30 recorded at 17.00 - 2.1%

No wonder why they struggle to find a sponsor for the event their fandom for the show is pretty much non-existent.

GianlucaTomoe
18th December 2015, 15:33
"Under current rules" as they say.
We know how fast that can change.

But the rules haven't changed. The fact that Australia participates doesn't mean that now all the Associate members can participate too.

EscGeek
18th December 2015, 16:13
xyes Kazakhstan is now one of us :mrgreen:

GRE
18th December 2015, 21:09
The EBU confirmed to ESCToday that under the current rules of the Eurovision Song Contest Kazakhstan is NOT ELIGIBLE to compete in Eurovision next year, thus ruling out the possibility of seeing the country debut in the competition in Stockholm. The participation of SBS and Australia at the Eurovision Song Contest is an exceptional case.

A-lister
19th December 2015, 00:13
The EBU confirmed to ESCToday that under the current rules of the Eurovision Song Contest Kazakhstan is NOT ELIGIBLE to compete in Eurovision next year, thus ruling out the possibility of seeing the country debut in the competition in Stockholm. The participation of SBS and Australia at the Eurovision Song Contest is an exceptional case.

Yes, case being an English-speaking, Anglo-Saxic culturally "Western" country which fits EBU's vision for Eurovision... the hypocrisy of this organization is hilarious... the fact that a country that is as far as possible from Europe can take part but a country that has a geographical European part larger than many fully European countries have says it all.

GWTW1939
19th December 2015, 00:29
It's rather funny how in the last 2/3 years they aren't even bothering to cover up what their doing. Their basically changing everything to suit their agenda and letting it all hang out :lol:

I honestly don't know how anybody can continue to keep their head buried in the ground and claim things are better then ever. Is the denial that strong or do people secretly love it because its all pro-Western but won't openly admit it :? xfacepalm

Gera11
19th December 2015, 01:08
From oikotrash: "If we consider Australian participation a controversy one, imagine what will happen with Kazakhstan entering the contest. A country not only outside Europe but deeply corrupted and without any cultural liaison with the mainstream European audience. "

I honestly see this argument the same EBU uses. "Kazakhstan is not close to the mainstream European audience" and stuff like that. So now the mainstream european audience is the western world only? So if Russia ever sends a Tuvan singer then the contest will implode because suddenly we have an entry not mainstream enough? :lol:

Mickey
19th December 2015, 01:15
Basically it's just confirmation that, while geography is no longer a Eurovision eligibility requirement, EBU membership still is (until they change their minds). While I'm by no means an EBU supporter, I don't think pro-Western bias necessarily comes into it at this stage.

Mickey
19th December 2015, 01:19
Basically it's just confirmation that, while geography is no longer a Eurovision eligibility requirement, EBU membership still is (until they change their minds). While I'm by no means an EBU supporter, I don't think pro-Western bias necessarily comes into it at this stage.
Just went back and read previous page. Disregard that.

Chorizo
19th December 2015, 01:29
Why would anyone from outside the ex-USSR want one more country in the contest that would give its 12 points to Russia every single year no matter what and half of the remaining points to other ex-USSR countries? That's exactly what Kazakhstan would do. If there is one thing Eurovision doesn't need, it's further strengthening the biggest existing voting block. Furthermore, unlike in Australia, the contest isn't even popular there. I cannot see any reason why Kazakhstan should be allowed to join. It's not a European country and the special circumstances that apply to Australia don't apply to Kazakhstan.

AlekS
19th December 2015, 09:18
Why would anyone from outside the ex-USSR want one more country in the contest that would give its 12 points to Russia every single year...
They're going to use the jurors like San Marino! They don't even have enough televoters with such tragic TV ratings :lol:
The juries don't give 12pts to Russia all the time.

AlekS
19th December 2015, 09:20
Khabar officials: "It doesn't give us rights to take part in ESC".
Game over 8-)

Cyberbliss
19th December 2015, 09:28
Why would anyone from outside the ex-USSR want one more country in the contest that would give its 12 points to Russia every single year no matter what and half of the remaining points to other ex-USSR countries? That's exactly what Kazakhstan would do. If there is one thing Eurovision doesn't need, it's further strengthening the biggest existing voting block. Furthermore, unlike in Australia, the contest isn't even popular there. I cannot see any reason why Kazakhstan should be allowed to join. It's not a European country and the special circumstances that apply to Australia don't apply to Kazakhstan.

I almost completely agree with your analysis; though Kazakhstan is one of the very few "border" countries I would leave an open door for competing, it's a bridge-country across Europe and Asia (along with Lebanon, or at a broader extent Morocco). Not to mention that everyone wants Turkey back, but being Kazakhstan a pro-Russia country, and having a 26% Russian population (1 on 4 people is of Russian descent), it is somehow much more European than Turkey (in this historical period) so I wouldn't bother having a Kazakhstan delegation in ESC, if the matter is all about mentality. Of course, that should be the limit: Kazakhstan is the only ex-USSR country which would fit in ESC. Others such as Turkmenistan or Tajikistan are not even closer anymore to Russia and Europe both in mentality nor demographically so ok, Kazakhstan is the limit.

Stiven
19th December 2015, 11:57
Okay so it turns out that Khabar are not interested in joining the contest in the nearest future:
http://esckaz.com/2016/#en_20151218_1
Not really surprised after seeing their ratings for the contest (doesn't make sense financially)

Mickey
19th December 2015, 14:28
What's telling is that the EBU say that Kazakhstan can't enter under the "current" rules (which is true they'd need to be a member of the Council of Europe to become an active member).

However, with Australia now a permanent fixture at ESC, I still believe there has to be a new set of rules in place next year that gives some pathway for an associate member to take part. I doubt many associate members would actually be interested in taking advantage of the opportunity, but Kazakhstan seems to be among the most likely.

A-lister
20th December 2015, 14:44
Basically it's just confirmation that, while geography is no longer a Eurovision eligibility requirement, EBU membership still is (until they change their minds). While I'm by no means an EBU supporter, I don't think pro-Western bias necessarily comes into it at this stage.

Problem is that Australia isn't an EBU member, in fact they are not even eligible to be in according the current rules, so this is not even true. Associate doesn't equal actual member, but EBU bends their rules as they please to.


Why would anyone from outside the ex-USSR want one more country in the contest that would give its 12 points to Russia every single year no matter what and half of the remaining points to other ex-USSR countries? That's exactly what Kazakhstan would do. If there is one thing Eurovision doesn't need, it's further strengthening the biggest existing voting block. Furthermore, unlike in Australia, the contest isn't even popular there. I cannot see any reason why Kazakhstan should be allowed to join. It's not a European country and the special circumstances that apply to Australia don't apply to Kazakhstan.

This is the worst argument ever. Firstly out of the two Australia is the one that is not European, not by far even (if we stick to geographical definitions). Australia is not even an eligible EBU member (only associate member), and therefor not even eligible according to the current rules (as mentioned previously).

Kazakhstan on the other hand has a geographical European part bigger than many of the fully European countries taking part, so the part "not European" is completely false, and to define Europe out from a Western European/Anglo-Saxic cultural perspective is biased and wrong since Europe is so much more than just that. Australia might be culturally western/anglo-European, but it's not a European country regardless.

To use voting patterns as an argument is weak, yes that might be the case but then what? But then again is ESC only for "western" countries or what? This mindset is close-minded and imo not what ESC should be about.

Sammy
20th December 2015, 14:53
This discussion is leading nowhere. The arguments are exchanged more than one time from all sides. I really hope we know one of the 2016 entries soon, so that we can discuss something new.

Chorizo
20th December 2015, 15:25
Problem is that Australia isn't an EBU member, in fact they are not even eligible to be in according the current rules, so this is not even true. Associate doesn't equal actual member, but EBU bends their rules as they please to.

The same applies to Kazakhstan. They are not a member and not eligible to join the EBU.


This is the worst argument ever. Firstly out of the two Australia is the one that is not European, not by far even (if we stick to geographical definitions). Australia is not even an eligible EBU member (only associate member), and therefor not even eligible according to the current rules (as mentioned previously).

Kazakhstan on the other hand has a geographical European part bigger than many of the fully European countries taking part, so the part "not European" is completely false, and to define Europe out from a Western European/Anglo-Saxic cultural perspective is biased and wrong since Europe is so much more than just that. Australia might be culturally western/anglo-European, but it's not a European country regardless.

Geographically, most of the country is in Asia. Do you also consider Turkey a European country? I don't because only a small part of the country is in Europe and culturally it is quite different from Europe too. Turkey has the right to participate because it is within the EBA and it's an EBU member, not because it's European. Kazakhstan isn't even inside the EBA.

Australia is clearly not in Europe but Eurovision has been successful there for decades and Australia is culturally compatible with Europe, so I'm fine with their participation. Of course, others disagree with this, which is also a legitimate point of view. It's just my personal opinion that Australia's participation is justified and the EBU thinks the same (and they also think of the money, of course :lol:). Kazakhstan is basically a Central Asian country. A small part of the country is geographically in Europe based on the arbitrary definition of the border between Europe and Asia. Geographically, it's not more European than Turkey. The reason why I support Australia and don't want Kazakhstan in the contest isn't based on the geographic position of these countries anyway. If Eurovision were as successful in Kazakhstan as it has been in Australia for a long time, the situation would be quite different.


To use voting patterns as an argument is weak, yes that might be the case but then what? But then again is ESC only for "western" countries or what? This mindset is close-minded and imo not what ESC should be about.

Block voting is one of the biggest problems in Eurovision, so I'm against adding countries that would be prone for. It doesn't matter where the voting blocks are. A Western or Northern voting block wouldn't be any better than the ex-Soviet or ex-Yugoslavian voting blocks we have. I don't think anyone can seriously claim that Kazakhstan wouldn't hand out top points to Russia every single year. This is reason alone for me to be against the participation of Kazakhstan. If they weren't attached to a voting block, I would be much more welcoming to them.

Mickey
20th December 2015, 16:36
Problem is that Australia isn't an EBU member, in fact they are not even eligible to be in according the current rules, so this is not even true. Associate doesn't equal actual member, but EBU bends their rules as they please to.


I wrote that before I saw the bit about Kazakhstan becoming an associate member (see post underneath it). Was trying to say that EBU are only breaking their rules as far as allowing associate members in, not any old country. Not relevant now.

I agree, Australia's participation is in direct contravention of the current rules and hate the EBU's disregard for their rulebook. I had quite an entertaining discussion with them about it on twitter a while back.

A-lister
20th December 2015, 21:26
Chorizo

So what you basically say is that we can bend the rules for Eurovision if the country belongs to the Anglo-Saxic/Western European cultural sphere of countries? Regardless of the country being part of Europe or not? Europe is much more than this centric-view.

True, Kazakhstan (for some odd reason) is not within those old EBU borders, and therefor not eligible, but so is not Australia (by far) so based on that criteria (as in EBU broadcasting area), none of them should be in. Based on geographical definitions however (= Europe) then Kazakhstan has every right to be in, regardless of what people in here might think or want, it IS partly geographical European and that part (while not being the major part of the country alone) is still way bigger than many European countries.

Also, and you proved my point again, the reason why some don't want Kazakhstan but are totally ok with bending the rules for Australia, is a Western-centric world-view, I personally find it very sad how big part of what is ALSO Europe is being totally ignored and looked down at. Sorry to break it to you, but there's more to what is "European" than only British and Western European and ESC should be a contest to celebrate all Europe, not just one particular culture. Whether you like it or not, Russian (and other Eastern-Orthodox) aswell as some Turkic cultures are just as much Europe as British or French or Spanish, if you won't admit that then you don't know what Europe is in the first place.

Chorizo
20th December 2015, 22:18
Chorizo

So what you basically say is that we can bend the rules for Eurovision if the country belongs to the Anglo-Saxic/Western European cultural sphere of countries? Regardless of the country being part of Europe or not? Europe is much more than this centric-view.

Well, we cannot bend the rules but the EBU can, if doing so is popular. Australia's participation has been controversial among fans but the general audience didn't really get angry about it, did they? This is not about being Western or Eastern. It's about what is popular and makes the contest bigger and it's also about money. You have made this about West vs. East, not me. I am fine with Australia participating because of the circumstances but I also understand those who are against it. The hosts have been greeting Australia for many years and the final outcome of this was Australia actually joining the contest.


True, Kazakhstan (for some odd reason) is not within those old EBU borders, and therefor not eligible, but so is not Australia (by far) so based on that criteria (as in EBU broadcasting area), none of them should be in. Based on geographical definitions however (= Europe) then Kazakhstan has every right to be in, regardless of what people in here might think or want, it IS partly geographical European and that part (while not being the major part of the country alone) is still way bigger than many European countries.

Based on the geographical position, neither Australia nor Kazakhstan would be able to participate under the current rules. The reach of the EBU doesn't extend to Kazakhstan, so if you argue in favor of including Kazakhstan that is just your personal view about how the rules should be changed. It doesn't say anywhere that being geographically within Europe gives you the right to join the EBU. The rules could be changed, of course, but the rules could also be changed in many other ways. Others argue that culturally close countries outside of Europe should be able to join too, which is another subjective view. The rules are arbitrary and could be changed, so there is no objective answer to this. I can see your point but the EBU is currently not defined as a union of all countries within Europe and the current definition also includes countries outside of Europe. Where the line is drawn is up to the EBU. As I said, supporting Australia's participation is my subjective opinion. I don't claim that there is an objective basis for this.


Also, and you proved my point again, the reason why some don't want Kazakhstan but are totally ok with bending the rules for Australia, is a Western-centric world-view, I personally find it very sad how big part of what is ALSO Europe is being totally ignored and looked down at. Sorry to break it to you, but there's more to what is "European" than only British and Western European and ESC should be a contest to celebrate all Europe, not just one particular culture. Whether you like it or not, Russian (and other Eastern-Orthodox) aswell as some Turkic cultures are just as much Europe as British or French or Spanish, if you won't admit that then you don't know what Europe is in the first place.

For me it's not about Australia being Western. I can see myself supporting non-Western countries under the right circumstances. If a country like Japan, for example, had had broadcast Eurovision for thirty years on a major channel with rather high ratings, I wouldn't treat it differently than Australia now. It's just that Australia is the only country that has done that. My biggest concern about Kazakhstan is block voting, not that it's an Eastern country. Furthermore, Eurovision isn't popular there.

GRE
20th December 2015, 22:32
Let's finish this discussion:
In case Russia wins this year, it's highly likely for Kazakhstan to participate in 2017. :)

GWTW1939
20th December 2015, 22:47
Let's finish this discussion:
In case Russia wins this year, it's highly likely for Kazakhstan to participate in 2017. :)

I'll believe it when I see it. I have no doubt the EBU will do everything they can to prevent it and of course many fanboys will cheer them on. Judging from some posts in this thread I also have no doubt that many on this forum will join them as well. Considering how corrupt their acting, and getting away with it, the EBU can do just about anything to prevent a Russia win and people will here will support it :rolleyes:

Odalis
26th December 2015, 03:03
This mindset is close-minded and imo not what ESC should be about.

IMO but when someone gets obsessed with something to the point that's the only thing he's willing to talk about - i call it close minded.
Recently all your posts have been like this: "Ango yaddayaddayadda pro western blah blah blah juries tralalatralala" no matter what the topic was.
Can you please get your head out of the "western agenda to kill everything ethnic" and just skip that part? We've heard it so many times that we know what you're going to say next, word for word, every time, all the time. Just relax for darwin's sake xboring

eerik
26th December 2015, 20:34
EBU's pro-Western Anglo-Saxon conspiracy is so obvious!!!11 Wake up sheeple!!!111

Just look all the countries who have debuted at ESC since 2000:

Latvia
Ukraine
Albania
Andorra
Serbia
Montenegro
Bulgaria
Moldova
Armenia
Czech Republic
Georgia
Azerbaijan
San Marino
Australia

They're all English speaking Western countries!!!! All of them!!!

Oh, wait, they're not. Nevermind then.

Verjamem
29th December 2015, 02:38
I'm tired with hearing that argument "Kazakhstan? Just another possible 12 points for Russia" for 3492159847 times. We have some countries in the competition already, which give a lot of their points to Mother Russia and I'm not reading each year "Belarus/Ukraine/Azerbaijan/Latvia*/Lithuania*/Estonia*? They'll again give their 10/12 points to the Russia, why they even participate?" If you had better reasons, maybe use only them ;)

I'm disgusted too that EBU let Australia participate in Eurovision, while they don't permit Kazakhstan to do the same. I would be angry because of that, but I know the answer. Kazakh participation wouldn't let earn so much money to Ola Sand and his team, as Australian one does. I'm sure that Astana won't get their opportunity, as long as the same people will rule the EBU. They need more open-minded "dominion" to get a chance. Turkey is not European too (if we come deep into the culture, history, feeling of Europeness etc), but Jon Ola Sand care about them. Why? Because they pay one of the biggest participation fees after Big 5 countries.



* I know that Baltic states has nothing to do with Russia (except Soviet occupation in 1944-1990s), but each of them gave most of their points to the Big Neighbour in all-time, so they're part of the USSR voting block. That's a fact, not opinion.

GRE
29th December 2015, 07:57
* I know that Baltic states has nothing to do with Russia (except Soviet occupation in 1944-1990s), but each of them gave most of their points to the Big Neighbour in all-time, so they're part of the USSR voting block. That's a fact, not opinion.

That's because many russians live there.

Sammy
29th December 2015, 10:51
This whole discussion reminds me more and more of this:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dgp9MPLEAqA

:lol::mrgreen:

John1
29th December 2015, 12:41
I'm tired with hearing that argument "Kazakhstan? Just another possible 12 points for Russia" for 3492159847 times. We have some countries in the competition already, which give a lot of their points to Mother Russia and I'm not reading each year "Belarus/Ukraine/Azerbaijan/Latvia*/Lithuania*/Estonia*? They'll again give their 10/12 points to the Russia, why they even participate?" If you had better reasons, maybe use only them ;)

I'm disgusted too that EBU let Australia participate in Eurovision, while they don't permit Kazakhstan to do the same. I would be angry because of that, but I know the answer. Kazakh participation wouldn't let earn so much money to Ola Sand and his team, as Australian one does. I'm sure that Astana won't get their opportunity, as long as the same people will rule the EBU. They need more open-minded "dominion" to get a chance. Turkey is not European too (if we come deep into the culture, history, feeling of Europeness etc), but Jon Ola Sand care about them. Why? Because they pay one of the biggest participation fees after Big 5 countries.



* I know that Baltic states has nothing to do with Russia (except Soviet occupation in 1944-1990s), but each of them gave most of their points to the Big Neighbour in all-time, so they're part of the USSR voting block. That's a fact, not opinion.

That's exactly the truth when somebody says that the début of Kazakhstan will allow Russia to gather another 12 pts...
'The USSR voting block' as you said is very present, but I didn't mean to criticize those countries because they have to vote with their minds, then I could also blame the Western countries with the voting block which is less present than the other one but still...

Chorizo
29th December 2015, 18:45
I'm tired with hearing that argument "Kazakhstan? Just another possible 12 points for Russia" for 3492159847 times. We have some countries in the competition already, which give a lot of their points to Mother Russia and I'm not reading each year "Belarus/Ukraine/Azerbaijan/Latvia*/Lithuania*/Estonia*? They'll again give their 10/12 points to the Russia, why they even participate?" If you had better reasons, maybe use only them ;)

The countries you name are already participants and eligible to participate under the current rules. Being against changing the rules to let another country join is not the same as supporting to throw out a current member, which would also require changing the rules. I don't want to throw out current members but I also don't want countries like Kazakhstan to join. Why would the EBU change the rules to allow one more country from the ex-USSR to join although Eurovision isn't even popular there? This would indeed further strengthen the ex-Soviet voting block with most points going to Russia. The fact that we already have so many of these countries means that we must not let more of them join. The size of the current voting block is a good argument against increasing the size of the voting block even further. If the current voting block were smaller or if there weren't a voting block at all, Kazakhstan joining wouldn't be such a big issue.


* I know that Baltic states has nothing to do with Russia (except Soviet occupation in 1944-1990s), but each of them gave most of their points to the Big Neighbour in all-time, so they're part of the USSR voting block. That's a fact, not opinion.

The Baltic states had already been a part of Russia until the end of WWI, just like Poland, and the big problem with these countries is the large Russian minority that keeps voting for Mother Russia every single year, no matter what Russia sends to Eurovision. This kind of diaspora voting is one of the reasons why it was necessary to introduce the juries. Block voting and diaspora voting was ruining Eurovision in the 2000s. I want less of this, not more. Kazakhstan would make things worse. Fewer ex-Soviet countries would be good for the contest because of the voting patterns but throwing out existing members would be a tough decision, so we couldn't do that easily. The ex-Yugoslavian block voting was not as problematic in recent years because some of the countries from that region didn't participate for a few years. Next year they will be back to full strength, which is reason to worry. They will all give top points to each other again.

blein
29th December 2015, 19:49
I love your reasoning guys.
::12 from ::ee to ::ru is bad ( in this case, 30% russians live in estonia and votes for Russia, because russian artists are famous in estonia. )
but
::12 from ::se to ::no is good (in these cases, it clear neighborhood voting)
::12 from ::no to ::se is good

No one ever booooo when ::no gives ::12 to ::se ::fi ::is ::dk and visa versa

AlekS
29th December 2015, 19:53
Kazakhstan is going to use the jury all the time like San Marino because of low televoting figures :lol:
... in 2035 when they finally join as an active member? :rolleyes:


tehDRAMA in this thread
https://media0.giphy.com/media/3SVExCrwqkRa/200_s.gif

lowyby
29th December 2015, 21:42
I love your reasoning guys.
::12 from ::ee to ::ru is bad ( in this case, 30% russians live in estonia and votes for Russia, because russian artists are famous in estonia. )
but
::12 from ::se to ::no is good (in these cases, it clear neighborhood voting)
::12 from ::no to ::se is good

No one ever booooo when ::no gives ::12 to ::se ::fi ::is ::dk and visa versa

THIS

People didn't boo when The Netherlands gave Belgium their 12
And people booed when Cyprus gave 10 (not 12) points to Greece...
The hypocrisy of those ogay dudes

blein
29th December 2015, 22:01
Yes... but situation is more bad.... they dont boooo ...they chear it up... I was so mad about that "our hero" "Mans" "Hero" shit when he got 12p from ::dk ::fi ::is ::no..
it looked like no one wants ::ru to win... like Polina is villain... and Hero comes to save us... voting in 2015 looked like that for me... first they let russian win and in the end the hero comes ... and saves the day. JUST LISTEN WHEN LITHUANIA GIVES 12P TO LATVIA.. NO ONE CARES ABOUT LATVIA THERE.. ALL ARE HAPPY JUST BECAUSE LITHUANIA GAVE 0P TO RUSSIA AND SWEDEN TOOK THE LEAD. LATVIAN SONG WAS MUCH BETTER THAN SWEDISH SONG.. AND NO ONE CARE ABOUT IT.

GWTW1939
29th December 2015, 22:02
THIS

People didn't boo when The Netherlands gave Belgium their 12
And people booed when Cyprus gave 10 (not 12) points to Greece...The hypocrisy of those ogay dudes

The funny thing is people expect Cyprus to give Greece its 12 points, yet even when they didn't (which was pretty surprising) people STILL booed. "Ogay dudes" wouldn't be satisfied unless it was a big fat zero :rolleyes:

John1
29th December 2015, 22:15
I do agree with the hypocritical side of those who booed Eastern countries when they gave 12p or less to their neighbours but they seem to be dumb when the Western countries gave 12 pts or less to help each other..

Verjamem
29th December 2015, 23:13
...
Actually, I'm not upset because of any of voting blocks. I get a butthurt about people, who divide some of them on "acceptable" and "unacceptable" (like case of the Kazakhstan and other former Soviet republics), so we play in the same team.

The countries you name are already participants and eligible to participate under the current rules. Being against changing the rules to let another country join is not the same as supporting to throw out a current member, which would also require changing the rules. I don't want to throw out current members but I also don't want countries like Kazakhstan to join. Why would the EBU change the rules to allow one more country from the ex-USSR to join although Eurovision isn't even popular there? This would indeed further strengthen the ex-Soviet voting block with most points going to Russia.
You write that Kazakhstan's joining wouldn't be eligible. Okay, but the question is, why? Because they aren't in a "European Broadcasting area"? European Broadcasting Union are so inconsequent in their actions (Caucasian states are clearly outside EBA's borders, but it wasn't a problem to add them) that even letting USA to be member, wouldn't change the World at all.

You also say that Eurovision is not well-known in Kazakhstan (to put it mildly) and you're quite right here. However, isn't it a EBU's aim to promote their programs and improve quality of television in countries, which are members of the union? Each state affiliated to European Broadcasting Union had to begin somewhere and probably some of them were in a as bad condition as Kazakh broadcaster at the moment, but they got their opportunity.

You already know my opinion about block voting, so I won't go tpoo deep into that. I'll only say that IMO considering some "controversial" votings as a problem is not a fully proper attitude. Eurovision Song Contest is a people's competition and that's how people votes. Of course, we can hire selected, 100% neutral people (is it even possible?) to rate songs, but will it be the same ESC as before?


Kazakhstan is going to use the jury all the time like San Marino because of low televoting figures :lol:

Some of results of jury's voting in 2015 GF

::sm San Marino
1st - ::lv Latvia
2nd - ::it Italy
3rd - ::au Australia

::by Belarus
1st - ::ru Russia
2nd - ::ee Estonia
3rd - ::be Belgium

::az Azerbaijan
1st - ::ru Russia
2nd - ::ge Georgia
3rd - ::il Israel

::gr Greece
1st - ::it Italy
2nd - ::cy Cyprus
3rd - ::ru Russia

::no Norway
1st - ::se Sweden
2nd - ::lv Latvia
3rd - ::au Australia

::dk Denmark
1st - ::se Sweden
2nd - ::au Australia
3rd - ::ru Russia

::is Iceland
1st - ::se Sweden
2nd - ::no Norway
3rd - ::lv Latvia

::md Moldova
1st - ::ro Romania
2nd - ::se Sweden
3rd - ::au Australia

I think I get your point, but I guess you would agree with me that juries doesn't always change the situation ;)

LesterMalvo
30th December 2015, 00:19
it looked like no one wants ::ru to win...

If no one wanted Russia to win, they wouldn't hit the 2nd place. It's a serious success to reach there.

AlekS
30th December 2015, 00:49
I think I get your point, but I guess you would agree with me that juries doesn't always change the situation ;)
Russia and Sweden became #2 and #1 in the end and they had a gr8 songs :rolleyes: Italy was the 1st in televoting so I see no crime & why does it have to change "the situation".
Romania - Moldova .... the song in Romanian/English from the popular band.
The only suspicious thing from your list is Greece-Cyprus voting.

If I like Estonian, Latvian or Moldovan song I don't wanna be blamed in dumb neighbour/block voting. I'm Ukrainian who would voted for his "neighbours" in 2015 - Latvia & Estonia. So? If I was in the jury would it be "the situation" or something? :?

I hate blind voting but it also means that everyone elses' entries weren't good enough to influence it.

Verjamem
30th December 2015, 03:08
Now I don't really understand, what did you mean by "Kazakhstan is going to use the jury all the time like San Marino because of low televoting figures :lol:". National juries are almost the same as people behind the TVs and it's not a surprise their votes are similar.

John1
30th December 2015, 11:48
Now I don't really understand, what did you mean by "Kazakhstan is going to use the jury all the time like San Marino because of low televoting figures :lol:". National juries are almost the same as people behind the TVs and it's not a surprise their votes are similar.

Kazakhstan won't merely use a jury instead of televote as San Marino does, that's ridiculous ! Kazakhstan is 1349191x bigger than San Marino, so that's not kinda useful...

Sim
30th December 2015, 13:36
well in Kazachstan it's 5 hours later than here.
So the final show would start at 2am and end about 5am :P

Don't think there will be many televoters

John1
30th December 2015, 14:07
well in Kazachstan it's 5 hours later than here.
So the final show would start at 2am and end about 5am :P

Don't think there will be many televoters

Australia this year ? That almost was the same hours of ESC's airing/broadcasting...

Sim
30th December 2015, 14:08
Australia this year ? That almost was the same hours of ESC's airing/broadcasting...

well in Australia it was already morning again when the show started and certainly when it ended,...
Don't get me wrong, I would not be against a participation of Kazachstan, but I don't think the public their would be hugely interested

AuroraBorealis
30th December 2015, 15:02
well in Australia it was already morning again when the show started and certainly when it ended,...
Don't get me wrong, I would not be against a participation of Kazachstan, but I don't think the public their would be hugely interested

You don't know until they are given the chance. Are there viewing figures for Kazakhstan?

Stiven
30th December 2015, 15:09
You don't know until they are given the chance. Are there viewing figures for Kazakhstan?

Yes here they are:
TV rating of the broadcast of the show in Kazakhstan according to TNS Central Asia data were as following:
May 25 live at 01.00 - 0.4%
May 26 recorded at 17.00 - 1.6%
May 27 live at 01.00 - 0.6%
May 28 recorded at 17.00 - 1.3%
May 29 live at 01.00 - 0.9%
May 30 recorded at 17.00 - 2.1%

So according to the stats Kazakhstan will likely use juries since interest is pretty much non-existent, however Kazakhstan is not even trying to enter so the entire discussion is kinda pointless at the moment.

AuroraBorealis
30th December 2015, 15:15
Yes here they are:
TV rating of the broadcast of the show in Kazakhstan according to TNS Central Asia data were as following:
May 25 live at 01.00 - 0.4%
May 26 recorded at 17.00 - 1.6%
May 27 live at 01.00 - 0.6%
May 28 recorded at 17.00 - 1.3%
May 29 live at 01.00 - 0.9%
May 30 recorded at 17.00 - 2.1%

So according to the stats Kazakhstan will likely use juries since interest is pretty much non-existent, however Kazakhstan is not even trying to enter so the entire discussion is kinda pointless at the moment.

Yeah, juries will have to exist if they did join. I think they could rack up much more interest if they participated in it.

AshleyWright
30th December 2015, 15:30
Yes here they are:
TV rating of the broadcast of the show in Kazakhstan according to TNS Central Asia data were as following:
May 25 live at 01.00 - 0.4%
May 26 recorded at 17.00 - 1.6%
May 27 live at 01.00 - 0.6%
May 28 recorded at 17.00 - 1.3%
May 29 live at 01.00 - 0.9%
May 30 recorded at 17.00 - 2.1%

So according to the stats Kazakhstan will likely use juries since interest is pretty much non-existent, however Kazakhstan is not even trying to enter so the entire discussion is kinda pointless at the moment.

Unless I calculated incorrectly, that is still about 150,000 people watching the final live. As far as i'm aware Czech Republic only got about 90,000 viewers for one of the semi finals and still managed to get a public vote.

However while I do agree that the discussion at this point is useless, I do think that the interest is so low purely because of how late the contest is aired and the fact Kazakhstan isn't taking part - so why bother watching?

Gera11
30th December 2015, 15:50
I do think that the interest is so low purely because of how late the contest is aired and the fact Kazakhstan isn't taking part - so why bother watching?

Exactly that. For example, here in Romania, if we won't take part in that year, I bet literally no one would watch. People are more interested in what the heck we are going to send and express their conspiracy theories like "only rich countries can win, EBU doesn't let Romania to win" every year.

John1
30th December 2015, 16:02
You don't know until they are given the chance. Are there viewing figures for Kazakhstan?

Could we ask us the question above ? "Would it have in Kazakhstan a popular viewing figure ?"
We might ask us the question with SM and AZ in 2008 when they made their débuts.. or even Moldova in 2005..

AshleyWright
30th December 2015, 16:05
Exactly that. For example, here in Romania, if we won't take part in that year, I bet literally no one would watch. People are more interested in what the heck we are going to send and express their conspiracy theories like "only rich countries can win, EBU doesn't let Romania to win" every year.

Same here. If we wasn't in the final, literally no one would even watch it. Even the BBC apparently said once that if we wasn't in the final then there would be no way on earth they'd show the final on BBC 1 - because it would be such a waste of that Saturday slot.

John1
30th December 2015, 16:07
Exactly that. For example, here in Romania, if we won't take part in that year, I bet literally no one would watch. People are more interested in what the heck we are going to send and express their conspiracy theories like "only rich countries can win, EBU doesn't let Romania to win" every year.

If you want Romania to get rid of the lack of interest with ESC, then they should manage to send great songs like 2010 (and 2011 but...)

AshleyWright
30th December 2015, 16:25
If you want Romania to get rid of the lack of interest with ESC, then they should manage to send great songs like 2010 (and 2011 but...)

Romania always do well. 12th-ish place is nothing to be upset about imo, but apparently it is for Romanians.

NeonProject
30th December 2015, 16:40
Getting very bored of Australia being brought up time and time again and the same stupid remarks being made.

In all honesty, I would adore Kazakhstan participating, just as much as I enjoy Australia participating.

It's a shame I came into this thread to see people being excited about Kazakhstans path to the contest (and possibly with some great Kazakh music), only to see the same old people whining like spoilt brats about Australia.

I came for Kazakhstan, instead people STILL feel the need to talk shit about Australia, no matter what the topic. This type of moaning and drama is actually causing me to start detesting the Eurovision fandom, which is a shame when I know there are more positive ones out there. It's just getting harder to see them through all this cloud of negativity.

Fair enough, air your opinion, but it gets to a point where you're shoving it down peoples throats and you start to agitate people who are just trying to enjoy the contest for what it is.

I would love for Keshyou to compete in the future! :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWV-JUNPK1Y

John1
30th December 2015, 17:06
Zhanar Dugalova won the Türkvizyon SC 2014 for Kazakhstan, isn't she amazing ?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y61PXxa903I

AuroraBorealis
30th December 2015, 17:15
Romania always do well. 12th-ish place is nothing to be upset about imo, but apparently it is for Romanians.

If only the UK could do well and consistently make top 15.. since 2010 we've came 25th (last), 11th, 25th, 19th, 17th, and 24th. :(

nekoisneko
30th December 2015, 17:46
I would love for Keshyou to compete in the future! :)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWV-JUNPK1Y


Zhanar Dugalova won the Türkvizyon SC 2014 for Kazakhstan, isn't she amazing ?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y61PXxa903I

Or even Lashyn has a great song to be enjoyed xlove


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5ks6Bc1qLY

John1
30th December 2015, 17:49
Romania always do well. 12th-ish place is nothing to be upset about imo, but apparently it is for Romanians.

I don't blame them with their manners when they're facing it in front of their TV's screen. :lol: :lol:
We (French people) usually behave as douches when France isn't on the left side of the scoreboard => Could you imagine our reactions whom we have since 2010. :lol:

Gera11
30th December 2015, 18:10
Romania always do well. 12th-ish place is nothing to be upset about imo, but apparently it is for Romanians.

We are worse than Azerbaijan when it comes to expectations. xrofl2 TVR literally says every year that we're going to win ._. Of course for the casuals 12th place is a disaster when you think we were the favourites, lol.

Sabiondo
31st January 2016, 04:10
Finally EBU is given their first steps with ::kz looking forward to a future Kazakh participation in Eurovision in the future: Khabar TV joins as associated member in the EBU :mrgreen:

http://www3.ebu.ch/about/members?type=associate

The following steps: Counsil of Europe membership or EBU Invitation ala. Australia could be next for them.. x12s